Sports Car Nation, the hobby is the
people. Weekly news and interviews. It's your number one source. Sports Car Nation, the hobby is the people. What is up everybody? Welcome to episode Sports Car Nation. John Newman. Glad to be back. got a guest on today. He's been on the show, but it's been a while and always a pleasure uh getting to talk to him uh chop up the hobby. Has his own podcast that's doing uh super well and uh full-time in the hobby now between that and and other things. And so, uh Brett McGrath is our guest uh from Stacking Slabs on today's program. Uh before we get started, uh kudos to all our great sponsors for without who uh without them this show doesn't happen. So uh Iron Sports Cards, uh Sports Collectors Digest, uh Hobby Hotline, and Upper Deck. And uh great great to have them part of the Sports Card Nation family. So with that out of the way, let's uh get to talking with uh Brett McGrath of Stacking Slabs. All right. Happy to have this next gentleman on the Sports Card Nation guest line. It's he's been a a part of this program before, but it's been a couple years. And I I tell you the truth, I didn't even realize it till I kind of looked it up and uh much too long. So, uh, uh, time to have him back on, uh, and, uh, great guy doing great content, uh, in his own right. Uh, Brett McGrath of Stacking Slabs. Welcome back, John. Thanks for having me. Time flies when you're having fun. What I, even though it's been a couple years, uh, I definitely tune into Sports Card Nation and enjoy all the conversations you have, especially when Dr. Beckett's on. I always find his his insight uh, always gives me something new to think about. But what I like about this is you you were doing this before I started and you're still doing it now. And I just I love not not only creators being here and creating and sharing thoughts and their opinions and bringing on guests, but just the longevity and consistency. So, Sports Card Nation's been an institution for quite a while and uh glad to be a part of it today. Well, well, thank you. And that's just another way of saying I'm old and you're I can't deny it. my birth certificate uh gives me away. No, no, I I appreciate all joking aside and you're right whenever I have Dr. Jim on and I've known him a while and he's a friend and I know you know him. Um you know it's it's he makes you think he sees it from a different angle and he's like after I I talk with him I'm like how come I like that was like you made that seem so easy. How come I didn't like you almost kind of secondguess yourself but that's just you know he's done this a long time. He's a brilliant guy. Um, and that's just the the genius of of Dr. Jim. And so, yeah, no, no doubt. That's why he's a great guest, right? Is because he makes you look at it from a a different perspective. And uh uh and listen, uh you you likewise, right? You're you're very intelligent. You've been in this. You're not new to the hobby. You know, like you said, you started after me. It wasn't like that far after me. So, uh, you're in that OG, uh, category, uh, as well. And that's that category has there's a lot of shows now compared four, six years ago, uh, when we started, uh, and whatnot. Well, kind of. We'll start off there, Brett. Like, you know, is that good? Is that bad? Is it it'll just shake itself out? Will people just listen to shows they enjoy and the proof sort of in the pudding? Is that really is the is simple as that? I think uh I often say this like I create a lot of content and have a ton of conversations as do you and share those out publicly and just go through this cycle of constantly doing it. But on the other side of it, I'm probably just as big of of a consumer of content in the hobby. I go on a lot of walks, run, and I'm always listen to hobby podcasts. And I'll tell you this, like I'll listen to other podcasts outside of hobby podcasts, but when there are new hobby podcasts available, they're always the ones that I want to listen to first. And I just think like the diversity of a voices opinions, different flavors of the hobby, like even if it's something that I don't do or don't collect and someone's covering it on the podcast, I I try to listen because it makes me more informed. And so I think what what I've noticed over this stretch of um you know talking into a microphone to uh collectors for so long is that you know a lot of people will start projects and but it's really hard to keep them going and I think the the creators that continue to keep their podcast going um have a passion and usually that passion shines through. So, I always encourage any listeners like if you have a unique angle or something you want to talk about like start a podcast and uh it's I'll listen to it. I'll definitely listen to it. Um but yeah, it's as you know, it's it's not easy to keep the the ship uh going uh for a long time. But yeah, it's been fun and always appreciate new shows to listen to. Yeah, well said. And and I was saying, you know, you look at yourself and you look at myself, you know, who's doing more running and more walking. that's more apparent and listening to probably more content because be because of that. So, uh but no, it's it's you know there's just so the hobby is just so diverse as well like you said that there is room for content that's kind of being done different um you know and and I' I've stayed sort of true. I' I've changed things here and there. You know, I talked even before we went uh live and and and told you, you know, we went even double episodes here with with guests instead of one big long one just for uh just from from listener feedback and just, you know, for for my schedule too to uh full transparency, it's made kind of my job uh I don't even want to say job, but made my life a little bit easier in kind of scheduling these out and and getting folks on. Uh but yeah, you know, uh you know, it's it's and no matter what you collect, there's probably a show uh that pertains to it. And uh I want to segue into a part of the hobby you're uh a part of and very familiar with, and that's uh the wrestling uh hobby and wrestling in general, right? I had uh uh about a month ago, Drake McGrder, a friend of yours on. I had Gellman, Adam Gellman on in the past. The one thing I I even though I'm not a wrestling card guy, I you don't have to be to see how tight-knit that community and how passionate that community is. Uh I'd even say like I don't know if you agree with it. It I I know it's a smaller segment, but they seem even closer than other sports uh hobby. Uh I guess two-pronged, right? Am I right? and and what do you attest that uh to I think it there's a nature of uh it's kind of like a startup category in a way and uh when you're forming and you're growing you tend to know everybody or most people and you know what the types of cards or wrestlers or products that you those collectors in the community collect and there's a sense of wanting to help those individuals out. I'm not going to there there there's competition, right? there's competition in other categories, but I think the the shared passion which for many uh wrestling card collectors comes from childhood um is something that uh people are able to connect on. Um I'll also say you mentioned Gellman like there's individuals in the space who have been organizers and sometimes it takes individuals who are super passionate and have a voice and are want to create content and I think like we are in this era where we're moving towards like more focus and niche content for specific categories and Gellman has really been the leader of that for the wrestling card community. Um, I'm a member of his Patreon group, uh, main event and he's I got I get an up I get an email regularly that new article, new conversation, whatever is, uh, put out there. But I know Galman pretty well and Gellman is super passionate and he wants to share information and that information coming from manufacturers, information coming from people he's talking with. And so I just think what's what I like about the wrestling card community is there's just always a flood of information, always uh information about sales and where cards are, what's available, and yeah, it as as you expand and categories grow, it gets harder and harder to operate that like that. But I think that's what a cool part is about uh wrestling cards in the community around it right now. Yeah. And I I think you tell me if you agree with this too, Brett. Like even, you know, even with sports cards, obviously now sports cards and and the hobby, it's making mainstream news at at record clips. Uh especially the last few years, especially uh since co, you know, at at one point you you were probably it wasn't really as cool to be in the hobby as it is, let's say today. People were reluctant to even say, hey, you know, I collect baseball cards or football card, whatever, you know. And I I think even with wrestling cards, there was that stigma. Uh whether it was right or wrong or but now I think just with the explosion of everything else. Um and listen, no one's denying how popular wrestling is. You see the the soldout arenas and the pay-per-views. Uh but I think too it's it's there was sort of a bugaboo like if you if if someone knew like, oh, you collect cards. I think we're way past that point. Uh but I think because we're way past that point uh it's it it makes it easier to do in that uh tighter and I think maybe because that community remembers when it wasn't like it was like it is now uh and how it was a little more like you kind of kept it behind closed doors or yourself that uh that uh maybe that's that factors in there too. Yeah. those those individuals who were collecting uh cards when they weren't cool and especially collecting wrestling cards when they weren't cool and have been here the whole time are certainly probably doing pretty well for themselves. Uh cuz you know that that category is is grown, right? New people coming in um passion being shared. Um you've got you know the Netflix deal with WWE. You've obviously got tops coming in, grabbing the the license, which adds a whole another marketing element to everything at new eyeballs. It's it's been growing quickly in real time. I'll tell you, I went to Wrestlemania in Vegas this year with my best friend. We met when we were three or four years old, uh, playing with wrestling figures at our brother's YMCA basketball game. Still friends today, best friends. Still talk about wrestling all the time. But we we we got the hall pass from our wives that you know we both turned 40 this year and it was like all right we're going to go to Vegas and young bucks. She's still young bucks at over the hill but yeah I'll take it John. Uh but yeah we we went there and we went to WWE access and went through and did it all. And I'll tell you what man no everywhere you turned were wrestling cards promotion of tops chrome. We walked into um Allegent where the Raiders play where the event was and right when I walked in there was a huge cardboard cutout of a Topps Chrome autograph Ria Ripley card and I look around and there's just promo for cards everywhere. Now I've been going to wrestling events my entire life. I've never seen anything like that. So part of the growth, right, is people sharing information and people passionate and community organizers like Gelman, but then it's also like you've got a manufacturer who's like going allin on the promotion of new products and exposure to an audience. And what's crazy about wrestling fans is wrestling fans aren't scared of spending money. They'll spend money on tickets, t-shirts, memorabilia, action figures, but cards have never really been a part of that. And now they very much are. And it's it's fun to see it getting going. Uh yeah, and it's important, I think, too, for the the the sport itself to embrace uh the hobby because I think they sort of they have to they have to they're not mutually exclusive. I think they need sort of need each other or at least, you know, the the hobby needs wrestling maybe more so, but you know, the more people who are into the hobby, the the more fans you're going to have. Time for a quick break, but we'll be Hobby Hotline is the Hobby's only live interactive call-in show. Join some of your favorite hobby personalities every Saturday, 11:00 a.m. Eastern, 8:00 a.m. Pacific to discuss the hottest hobby topics. If you miss us live, catch us after the fact on all major podcast platforms. Follow us on socials at Sports Card Nation has returned. When I had Gman on, I talked about this like does the sport itself like do enough to promote the fact that because I you mention I'd love to see, you know, when you go to a wrestling event, you know, you go through you come through the door and you get a promo pack of some sort. Uh, and I I would venture a guess, and you tell me if I'm right or wrong, Brett, there's people going to get this promo pack who probably don't even realize they're actually wrestling cards. Maybe they're buying the shirts uh and that sort of thing or the belts and and stuff. They don't even realize they're trading cards and that might be their their avenue to know that they exist. And and here we have a new wrestling card hobbyist, right? And and what's that take, right? It doesn't it it doesn't you know I I know there's printing and stuff like that but uh I mean just think about what you know a kid walks through he's already excited he's going to watch some of his his favorite wrestlers probably perform live in front of him rather than on TV and then he's handed a pack and maybe doesn't even know cards exist. And I I'm mentioning kids but this could be adults uh as well. Kind of your thoughts on maybe seeing some more of that. Yeah, I think uh I think we will see more of that just based on my observations of how uh Topps is operating right now. Um one of the things that I noticed was, you know, they dropped the Cactus Jack version of Topps Chrome while we were at Wrestlemania. You know, you could buy it at the show and you could, you know, resell it the the the the online for, you know, multiples. So like there's that element too of like people like immediately flipping wrestling cards. U but it just adds a whole another element I think in terms of exposure. One of the things that just like blew my mind seeing this for the first time but I was like sitting on my couch. I was watching Raw on Netflix and this was like a few months ago but they were doing like a matchup. They're like highlighting the main event or the next matchup and I remember vividly like one of the perform performers was Damen Priest and I can't remember who he was wrestling against but they showed the matchup as they segueed the commercial and they were highlighting them in cardboard form. It was like their tops chrome cards on the screen and I was like that's a pretty cool way to promote the product like during the show as a part of the show. And so I think in this era of WWE, they're definitely more open to sponsors than they were uh in a previous era. And I think it's a good opportunity for uh wrestling cards to get more eyeballs. Yeah. And I think the Fanatic Tops brand that's kind of, you know, they do a good job of of promoting um themselves and what the what they've gotten the license for. Do you think it's as simple as that where maybe a prior uh card company just kind of failed uh in in that department and maybe it it hurt? Maybe that's why they don't have the license anymore. You know, I hate to make it as black and white as that, but you know, you have Yeah. I I uh what I can say is that whether you like what they're doing or you don't like what they're doing, the approach that Fanatic/Tops is taking to get attention has never been seen before. And it it it works in this era of being online scrolling. It's the way they're approaching influencers, the way they're approaching getting each product line out, events like Fanatics Fest is something like we we haven't seen before. So, if you're a company like WWE and they're talking about all this new modern ways to promote and involving talent and, you know, using digital channels and different strategies and using influencers like if you're chances are that's probably going to be appetizing for those decision makers. Um, and I don't I couldn't tell you begin to tell you how all those deals went down and why they went down, but they're Fanatics is a marketing machine. They're a marketing company and it like they promised they were going to do that and they're delivering on that. At least I've been seeing that in the Yeah, no doubt. And I'm not even a wrestling guy per se, Brett, and yet I'm picking that up. So, what's that? What's There you go. I'm seeing some promos for matches and like you said, they're using the the the you know the wrestlers on the cards as part of that uh promo for that match. And uh uh maybe as simple as that. Someone says, "Hey, that's a card." Like who get those? Who makes them? How do I obtain them? That sort of thing. It's it's it's I know it's not as simple as that, but something as simple as that can can bring a whole bunch of new hobbyists into the the fold. And I truthfully I I don't know if you agree. I expect I I'm assuming that the wrestling hobby is going to grow as a result of of the fanatic tops input. I I would imagine so. And one thing that I'll just call out that I've noticed that just to show to tell the listeners where this is right now in terms of uh the promotion side whenever I've observed this whenever there's a new product to be opened you have Triple H Icon WWE Hall of Famer chief creative officer the guy in charge of the product right now they do a uh a video of him and Sam Roberts who's a a uh he's got a wrestling podcast, but they just Triple H just is sitting there opening up the packs and they're talking about the cars. It's like that never would have been done under the Vince McMahon era. And I just think it's like that content's probably not for everyone. But if you're a kid and you're watching wrestling and you collect cards and never have connected the dots and you see a video of Triple H opening up the new Tops Chrome Pack, like it's probably going to get your attention. So, I think those sorts of tactics uh they're they're employing right now and I think, you know, we're talking about them on a podcast, so they're they're doing Yeah. And I'm not a wrestling guy and I have nothing against it. I'm just not my it's not my lane, right? And like you just said, we're both talking about it. So, and I've had even more people on the show to talk about it. And uh that's that's saying something uh uh right there. All right. So, we'll put a bow a little bow on on wrestling as it's about to uh grow even more. Uh, you know, let's talk about your content. Uh, stacking slabs. Uh, like you said, I I know you said you're after me. I don't look at it like that. I look at it like we're all in the fraternity, right? We all can't graduate uh the same year. And if you if the graduation's earlier, it just means I'm older and I'm getting older uh quicker. Um, again, we've seen a change, but even even your cats changed. Um, uh, I don't know when I I I'll kind of put you not really on the spot, but you're now full-time in the hobby, which which is awesome. Kind of talk about that progression. Uh, how tough of a decision or maybe not to to do that. Um, any nervousness to, you know, anytime you I think any anyone I've talked to who's done that, Brett always said, "Yeah, it is." you know it's a little unknown like it's known and unknown and you you're about but every story is is unique and every journey is unique kind of uh for you kind of talk how how you got there and and the thoughts about doing it yeah I'll give the brief overview so I have I spent previously uh the last 15 years of my career working in uh B2B marketing mostly for software companies in a marketing function and worked for companies all shapes and sizes. But throughout that experience, I did uh a I did marketing and I did content and I built brands and I did podcasting. I did did a lot of of uh you know, brand building. And during COVID, I got really bored and was working from home and was thought, you know, I could take what I'm doing professionally and apply it to the hobby. And that's was really the genesis of stacking slabs is like I was bored. I just wanted to meet other collectors who've been doing it longer than me and maybe we can create some content um along the way. That turned into a 4-year passion project. And it's like, you know, it it's like once you start and you're really into it, you can't really stop. And while I was working, it felt like uh you know, kind of two jobs at once. And then 2024, I was working for a startup that I put three years in and it ran out of funding and I lost my job. So, it was like the first time uh in my career I did not have a job and I had to figure out what I wanted to do and really my mindset was around well I'm spending all this time with stacking slabs and the content. I made all these connections like what what can I do in order to set myself up and be able to do this full-time. During that time as I was plotting uh meeting with people trying to figure out the path I took a a contractor job and then that contractor job I didn't want it to but it it ended up becoming a full-time gig while I'm trying to run stacking slabs and take it off the ground and do it full-time and then it just reached this crossroads. It was it was okay. Well, I've made enough of the right connections and financially I think I'm in a position to be able to make this happen. Uh luckily because I've got an awesome audience and some great sponsors and I talked to my wife November of last year and she said go do it. And I next day I got on and talked to my CEO and felt like maybe blindsided him a little bit, but uh I left and really never looked back. And so I've been, you know, working for myself, building out stacking slabs since November of 2024 and I haven't looked back. I can't tell you how fortunate I feel every day that I can wake up after I take my kids to school and come back to the desk and have just an endless amount of uh content and things to work on all hobby related. And it's I feel very fortunate and it feels very much like I'm just getting started this year. We have expanded. We've almost got a new show coming out uh every day. We're starting new shows, niche, f category specific. WNBA card podcast is one of them that's launched. We just launched the football card podcast. We're working with show with shows with sponsors. And so there's no in it's the the work is it's never ending. It's never ending. There's there's there's formatting. There's the outreach to have these conversations. There's the conversations. And then it's do it all over again. And I was looking at my calendar, John, uh, for tomorrow. And I have a mini little vacation with my family, which I haven't taken a vacation in forever with my family right before the national and I just looked and I have four recordings all in a row tomorrow. And I'm just like, this is what I signed up for, but I love it. So, I feel very fortunate. It's the best. This is the best. I've I've had many jobs and I've worked for many awesome companies, many great people. This is easily the best job I've ever had. Yeah. And you love it. you're passionate about. I know we throw that word around sometimes uh too easy, right? Love or passionate, but when you really do, right, it comes through. I think it comes through uh in in your content. I I know I get that from you. It's not there's no phoniness there. It's it's genuine. You can tell sometimes, you know, when someone's sort of going through the motions. You know, someone asked me, Brett, like, you know, John, how when will you know like your podcast is like you're done? like and it's a real simple answer. I didn't even have to think about it. When I turn on the mic and I don't want to or it's not fun anymore or I look at it as like uh you know I'm in in the teaching profession by day now and I love that gig. I'm not going to give it up even though I probably could with like you with the hobby side. Uh but I love the kids. But, you know, if I ever turn like it's like even knowing, hey, I'm going to come home and I'm going to have a great conversation most likely with Brett. Like, I look forward to that. If it and I don't foresee this, but hypothetically, if I would have been thinking like, ah, man, I got to talk to Brett. I'd rather jump in my hot tub. If I get to that point, like, and I get sometimes it might be a day, you know, you're just having an off day like an athlete, right? I went 0 for four. But if that becomes more like the norm, um, uh, which I don't I don't ever see that happening. But if it did, that's when that's when I know. And I always tell when I get asked that question, Brett, I always say I have nothing to do with downloads. You know, when I started this show, uh, it wasn't sponsored. It was slow going at first and then it just sort of built up. I'm sure you're you you know exactly what I'm talking about. And I never did the show to make money. That's a nice what's become a nice perk of it, but it's still not the real reason. Like if that even went away now, even after getting used to it, I still would do the show. It's it's more the internal feeling that like I don't want to do this anymore or I don't want to have this camera or I rather do this than that. And if that ever happens, again, I don't I don't foresee that. But if if that became the the happen stance or the circumstance, then that's all I need. I'll know then. Uh, and it'll have nothing to do with all the superficial and and financial aspects. Always awesome having Brett on the program. And here's the best part. This was only part one. So, part two will continue next week, our conclusion with Brett McGrath. And uh, hope you enjoyed uh, listening as much as I enjoyed uh, the conversation I had with Brett. And again, part conclusion part two. uh next Friday. All right, before we close out the show here with with some closing thoughts, I you know, I don't often bring in like outside the hobby stuff uh unless you're living under Iraq, you know, this week was a particularly difficult one uh living here in this country with some incidents and killings uh terrible, tragic and uh you know makes me very sad and sad to see it. I pray for families uh affected uh by these tragedies. I pray for everybody because we all should be affected by these tragedies. Uh uh that you could just be minding your own business somewhere and still be killed. uh that you may give your opinion of your beliefs and it may cost your life. And uh it's sad to say, but that's sort of where we are. Uh I still believe there's more good than bad in this world, just like I believe there's more good uh than bad in this hobby. But uh I pray for everybody um to get through these difficult times. And I pray that uh you know these stories uh are less prevalent uh than they have seemed uh to become. So we're going to close out the show with some uh more closing thoughts and wrap up uh this week's episode. Time for our Hobby is the people Hello, this is Mark Hy and remember the If you'd like to be the hobby is the people announcer of the week, do a WAV or MP3 file and send it to sportscardnationpc@gmail.com.
