April 24, 2026

Card Ladder's Chris McGill chops it us with us! E385

Card Ladder's Chris McGill chops it us with us! E385
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Card Ladder/Crossover's Chris McGill returns to the podcast and we chop up some hobby.


Talking points on this episode potentially include:


*State of the Hobby

*Travel Schedule

*NSCC and How We Navigate

*Hobby Burnout and How to Avoid it

*What's Your PC Like

*Evolution of Card Ladder

*Prices Realized..Vintage versus Modern.


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WEBVTT

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Sports Guard, Nations Hobby, It's the people weekly news and interviews.

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It's your number one soul sports Garnation. Hobby is the People.

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Sports Guarnation.

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What is up? Everybody?

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Welcome to episode three eighty five of Sports Coordination. As always,

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glad to be back, Happy Friday, happy whatever day you

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happen to be listening to this episode. And that being said,

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I want to thank you guys out there for, you know,

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as we wrap up our coming down the home stretch

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here of our seventh year. And that's crazy to say,

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but seven years on the podcast airwaves and without you,

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we don't exist. And so a heartfelt thanks there to

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everybody out there who make time. Wherever that met might

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be doesn't matter. We appreciate you, appreciate our sponsors, Iron

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Sports Cards, Sports Collectors, Digest, Hobby Hotline, and Upper Deck.

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UH.

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And so while we're mentioning all these great people and

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great things, let's talk about this week's and next week.

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A great guest and it's been a little bit since

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he's been on, but he's an alumnus of the show

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and a great hobby ambassador and advocate.

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UH.

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And I'm talking about Chris McGill Card Ladder House of

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Jordan's Fame crossover. Uh and uh, you know Collector and

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I'm sure I left off of Hattiewears, but uh, great

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Guys and other Hattiwears And it's been a little bit,

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so I thought it's time we have him back on it.

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And the one thing I h one of the things,

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not the one thing, one of the things I love

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about Chris is you know, you can chop when I

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chop it up with him right. There's no nothing off limits.

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And he doesn't mince words right, which is how I

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try to be. And I always find that refreshing, and

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it's you know, he's not trying to sell anything. We

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can talk about anything, and it's always a fun. One

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of my favorite conversations is when he's on and because

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I know even if he doesn't agree with me, he's

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gonna tell me, or if he does, he's gonna tell me.

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And that's you know, there's no great area and I

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appreciate that. So after that intro and with that being said,

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let's get this show started. Always happy to have the

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next gentleman on the Sports Carnation guest line. He is

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a multi time alumnus of that and it's been a

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little bit since the last time, so I figured I would.

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It's about time we have him back on. It's a

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guy that.

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Has his finger h firmly on the post of the hobby.

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Very insightful, very intelligent and always glad to have them

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part of this show. Chris McGill card Ladder Crossover. Uh

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you know House of Jordan's. I probably forgot a title there,

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but as always welcome.

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Thank you for the very kind introduction. John.

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It's always an honor too to get the chance to

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come on this show. Man, big fan of the show.

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I've been listening to. This show might even be close

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to a decade by now.

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It's where this will be our eighth thear That's that's crazy.

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Thank you.

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I remember in the show you didn't have a microphone.

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I remember in this show like I had to listen

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to and I still listened to.

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I was in the basement with a candle in the yeah, yeah, yeah, now, yeah,

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I appreciate that and coming from you like you're you're

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an o G as well, Like you know I've been

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called that, but you're you're in OG as well.

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We've done this in this time. Always glad to have you.

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Look we don't need to do.

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You know, we've been out enough. We don't like where

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it als. We've we've covered that. But like I said,

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you know you have your finger on the on the post.

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You're you're very active in the hobby. Again, let's say

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you're I'll make you hobby president. I know that's supposed

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to be Manginie. He's been impeached. You're the guy now

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stated stated state of the union right, good and bad? Like,

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what do you see the hobby right now? It's it's

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like every year it's in a way different spot, uh

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than the previous year. Between mergers and acquisitions, companies by

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the wayside, Uh, you know new companies.

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Uh, you know, how would you describe the landscape?

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And great question. Let me say this, John, John Manginie

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is unimpeachable. President Manginie is unimpeachable. All right, I feel

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like I I feel like I have Okay, I'm gonna

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go with the hypothetical and I'm gonna say that. So

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if I were, I'm gonna take a little creative license

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here sort of. If I'm giving the state of the Hobby,

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the theme of my speech would be caution and stop

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and smell the roses, okay, And I'm just coming up

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with this off the cuff, you know, I mean, you

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gave me a little warning that this question was coming.

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I've been thinking about a little bit, and this is

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where I would go with it. I think I would

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say caution and stop and smell the roses, because the

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hobby has a lot of flaws, has a lot of

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pain points, has a lot of things that could be improved,

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but nonetheless, it's it's a pretty okay hobby. It's a

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pretty good hobby, if I may say so. And things

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are going pretty well, and plenty of people are doing well,

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and plenty of businesses are doing well. Plenty of card

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shows are well attended. Marketplaces are setting record high volumes.

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People are having fun building their collections, people are having

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fun buying, selling, trading, dealing.

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And it's not guaranteed that it's always going to be

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like that.

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For as many flaws as exist today, and there are

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plenty of legitimate flaws that exist, and for as much

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room for improvement as there is, John it could be

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a lot worse. It could be a lot worse, and

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you know what it might be one day. I don't

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want to be negative, but I want to be pessimistic.

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I want to be realists and say that when something's

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going pretty well, and I just ask, you know, when

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when like the politicians say, ask yourself, were you better off,

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you know, four years ago or now? I say the

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to my fellow hobbyists, ask yourself, are you better off

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now than you were three years ago, four years ago,

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ten years ago? And maybe you were better off then,

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but maybe you're better off. But in any event, even

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if I feel like I was better off five years ago.

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You know, it's like that show The Office when they

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say I wish you knew. I wish I knew when

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the good times were so I could make sure to

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enjoy them as they're happening. Well, these might be the

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good times, So you know, that's my That's my message

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is let's and then and then the other part of it.

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So that's the stop and smell the roses part. The

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other part of it is caution.

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Caution to say things are good, but let's not make

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the mistake of getting overly indulgent and taking things too

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far and getting swept away and losing our sense of

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responsibility and and going beyond what our budgets are and

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being irresponsible and and not thinking long term.

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And so that's that's the other that's the other messages

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is caution.

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To to say that that we have to fight to

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preserve a good hobby experience.

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It's not just going to be handed to it. So

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we should be cautious, we should take.

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Stock of things, we should protect what we think is good,

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we should work on improving what we think isn't good,

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and uh and and and know that we're in we're

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in an upswing right now. I mean, generally speaking, the

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numbers are all pointing up. So let's be cautious. Let's

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let's be cautious and enjoy a good thing while we've

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got it.

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Well said, I agree. I like how you you know

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you you were optimistic, but you were real. You know

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you you kept it real, like, hey, not everything is

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roses and daisies and great sounding music.

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Right, just tread lightly. And you know, I've heard the term.

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You know, I've heard people self appoint themselves Chris, like,

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I'm a hobby watchdog. I've heard people tell me I'm

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a hobby watchdog. My answer always is, like, you know,

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number one, you don't self appoint your hobby watch dog.

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And we all need to be stewards of that. We're

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all hobby we should all be looking out for each

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other always bothers me a little bit when someone kind

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of knights themselves that because I think we all are

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in our own right if we're active participants, right, we

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should all try to help each other, you know, if

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we know something that can can make a difference or

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help someone else out or save them maybe from going

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down a pratfall. I believe we should all do that.

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I don't think it's one person's job or you know,

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I think it's all of us together. You know, when

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you hear that term hobby watchdog, like, what are your

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general feelings when you hear.

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That, I think you just hit the nail on the head.

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I'm reminded of something Josh Adams said the last show

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I did Live with Jeremy the Sports Cards Live, the

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Saturday night show. Josh Adams and I are like, sometimes

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we come on at the very end and we just

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chat a bit, and Josh said that hobbyists have a

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duty to educate each other, to help each other if

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they discover something or learn something to share it with

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the community. And that really resonates with what I think

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you're saying right here with the watchdog agle, that we

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all have a duty to be watchdogs. You know, this

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is a neighborhood watch and we should all be looking

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out for each other's homes. We should all be looking

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out to protect each other, and then expect the same

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in return that people are gonna look out for us too.

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And if we all kind of pull our weight, and

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if we all sort of step up a hobby watchdogs

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and we do it responsibly, and we you know, stay

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in our lane. Like, there are some things that I'm

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not an expert about. I don't know how to spot

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certain fakes, so somebody else is gonna have to fill

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in the gap there and do the things that I

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can't do. But if we all sort of chip in

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where we can, you know, kind of like a pot. Look,

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if we all bring a dish, we're all gonna be fed,

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We're all going to be taken care of. So I

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like that framing quite a bit. I think that's actually

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one of the best ways I've ever heard the hobby

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watchdog concept laid out, is that we all have the

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responsibility to be watched.

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Yeah, And I always feel and maybe it's not fair.

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I always feel when someone sort of like puts that

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tag on themselves or anoints themselves, I think it's almost

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more for their their ego, like hey, I'm this, and

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maybe you're you're not this, when I want to say, like,

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we're all this like you like you are, but so

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is everyone else, Like it's not you know, there's not

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a commission that said you are you know, Chris is

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and John isn't or is Chris is it? And so

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that's where I'm coming from. And like you said, we

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all I like the neighborhood watch analogy too. Right, the

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hobby is all of our neighborhoods. We should all be

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looking out for anything that's not above board or not right,

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and that's.

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Or even just helpful like you said, let's have a

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block party.

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And everyone bring bring a dish department pass and let's

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have some fun too. So it doesn't always have to

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have a negative connotation as well. Right information can be

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positive like hey, you know this this card short printed,

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or this number is not in the set for whatever happened,

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whatever reason. Things like that, right just useful information. Watchdog

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always has sort of a you know, crime stopper feel

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to it, and listen. We both know that there's that

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aspect in the hobby, so I'm not like papooing that

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or sweeping that on the rug.

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But it's not all that, right, that's a small percentage,

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I think.

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I think you'll agree there's more positive stories than thing

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negative ones. But like the regular news, right, what gets

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more rating is some of the negative stuff. So I

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think we kind of both taking along the same lines

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a little. Speaking of positive, let me let me put

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you a little bit. If I said, describe your PC today,

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how would what what? What?

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How would you answer that question?

233
00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:31.519
Describe my PC today? I would say, Uh, it's.

234
00:12:31.399 --> 00:12:33.840
Come a long way. It's come along with because I've

235
00:12:33.840 --> 00:12:37.039
come a long way as a collector, and I've I've

236
00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:40.200
learned so much. It's really the last few years for

237
00:12:40.279 --> 00:12:42.639
me as collected. In the last two years have been

238
00:12:43.200 --> 00:12:46.759
so much about researching, learning about sets, learning about history,

239
00:12:48.039 --> 00:12:52.559
diving deep into checklist building spreadsheets, learning about the significance

240
00:12:52.600 --> 00:12:55.720
of particular issues, and like finding ones that resonate with

241
00:12:55.759 --> 00:12:58.200
me and then like deliberately seeking those out to add

242
00:12:58.240 --> 00:13:01.320
to my collection. And you know, that's just it's it's

243
00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:03.279
come a long way. That's how I feel about my collection,

244
00:13:03.360 --> 00:13:07.240
and it's it would be it's it's it's unrecognizable compared

245
00:13:07.279 --> 00:13:10.039
to what my collection looked like ten years ago, it's

246
00:13:10.120 --> 00:13:12.720
unrecognizable compared to what it looked like five years ago,

247
00:13:13.120 --> 00:13:15.120
and probably five years from now it's going to be

248
00:13:15.200 --> 00:13:19.000
unrecognizable again. So you know, it's just it's evolving, it's changing,

249
00:13:19.639 --> 00:13:21.919
and that's what makes it fun. Like the thing that's

250
00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:24.360
just been lighting my fire for the last few years

251
00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:27.159
is research and learning more and more. Like maybe if

252
00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:29.039
I come across a new player I want to collect,

253
00:13:29.080 --> 00:13:32.320
and then I'll spend weeks making a spreadsheet of all

254
00:13:32.360 --> 00:13:35.759
of their rookie year cards, like for an ultra modern player.

255
00:13:35.559 --> 00:13:38.120
Anyway, it can take week, and I'll look at all.

256
00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:40.080
Of them and I'll find the ones that I really like,

257
00:13:40.200 --> 00:13:42.240
and then I'll build my safe searches and wait for

258
00:13:42.279 --> 00:13:44.039
those to show up. And you know, I've just I'm

259
00:13:44.080 --> 00:13:46.360
really uh, I've really come a long.

260
00:13:46.200 --> 00:13:48.399
Way as a collector. That's that's that's the first thing

261
00:13:48.440 --> 00:13:49.240
that comes to my mind.

262
00:13:49.360 --> 00:13:52.320
Yeah, no doubt, And and it's good to hear you

263
00:13:52.639 --> 00:13:55.200
say uh, because that's how I I'm sort.

264
00:13:55.000 --> 00:13:56.559
Of more down the middle.

265
00:13:56.600 --> 00:14:00.840
I'm of a Rookie card collector Hall of Fame, four Sports.

266
00:14:01.759 --> 00:14:04.320
But speaking of that, when you go to I know

267
00:14:04.360 --> 00:14:06.519
you're a busy guy when you're at the National, and

268
00:14:06.559 --> 00:14:08.519
I know you go to more shows in the Nationale.

269
00:14:08.600 --> 00:14:11.519
Now I use the National as a focal point.

270
00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:11.879
For this question.

271
00:14:12.039 --> 00:14:13.639
Do you go in and I know, I don't know

272
00:14:13.639 --> 00:14:17.519
how much time away from the booth or downtime if

273
00:14:17.559 --> 00:14:20.879
you will to kind of go around and maybe look

274
00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:23.759
at cases and pick up some stuff. Do you have

275
00:14:23.960 --> 00:14:26.720
like are you a guy that has like a target

276
00:14:26.720 --> 00:14:29.120
list or you kind of fly by the seat of

277
00:14:29.120 --> 00:14:31.440
your pants and say, you know what, something strikes me,

278
00:14:31.600 --> 00:14:32.600
like I like that?

279
00:14:33.159 --> 00:14:35.639
Or you more of a regimented where.

280
00:14:35.639 --> 00:14:37.679
Like, hey, I've got a list of five or ten

281
00:14:37.759 --> 00:14:40.799
cards or three cards or whatever. What's your approach and

282
00:14:41.159 --> 00:14:43.440
maybe you can take even the National part. You're at

283
00:14:43.440 --> 00:14:46.519
a card show and you're you're looking to acchoir cards.

284
00:14:46.639 --> 00:14:50.240
How do you what's your sort of modus operandi?

285
00:14:50.480 --> 00:14:54.480
I absolutely have preset ideas in my mind of what

286
00:14:54.480 --> 00:14:56.960
I'm looking for, but it's a big list, so you know,

287
00:14:57.000 --> 00:14:59.919
there's like it's almost like categories that I'm looking like.

288
00:15:00.159 --> 00:15:02.720
Nicole Jokis is a player that I collect. I know

289
00:15:02.840 --> 00:15:06.159
because of my research that he only has thirty six

290
00:15:06.759 --> 00:15:09.399
one of ones from his rookie year that are solo cards,

291
00:15:09.559 --> 00:15:11.120
and then he has two one of ones from his

292
00:15:11.200 --> 00:15:13.799
rookie year that are multiplayer cards. So he has thirty

293
00:15:13.840 --> 00:15:16.840
eight total, and I'm looking for any of those thirty eight.

294
00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:19.200
I've got five of them, and I'm looking for any

295
00:15:19.240 --> 00:15:21.879
of the other ones I don't have. So that's a category.

296
00:15:22.080 --> 00:15:24.720
And if one of those show up, you know, that's

297
00:15:24.759 --> 00:15:26.720
something that's definitely on my list that I might be

298
00:15:26.759 --> 00:15:29.279
interested in if we can work out a fair price.

299
00:15:29.559 --> 00:15:33.240
But I'm also very flexible, you know, like I'm not

300
00:15:33.320 --> 00:15:35.720
going in and saying, well, I need these three, Like no,

301
00:15:35.799 --> 00:15:38.480
I like the whole category. If it's a Jokish rookie

302
00:15:38.519 --> 00:15:41.120
year one of one, you know I'm interested. So I've

303
00:15:41.120 --> 00:15:43.200
got a pretty big list, like and I've got I've

304
00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:45.200
got that approach for all my PC players, where like,

305
00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:47.399
if a card fits into a category that I'm really

306
00:15:47.480 --> 00:15:50.519
excited about, then you know, there's probably hundreds of cards

307
00:15:50.600 --> 00:15:52.720
that could be of interest to me anytime I go

308
00:15:52.759 --> 00:15:55.000
to a show. But so I start with the list,

309
00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:56.799
but it's a big list, and then within that list,

310
00:15:56.840 --> 00:15:59.240
we can get real flexible in anything from that list.

311
00:15:59.279 --> 00:16:01.679
I might, you know, I might try to make a.

312
00:16:01.639 --> 00:16:04.399
Deal for Yeah, it makes sense when I go to

313
00:16:04.440 --> 00:16:07.279
then at you I'll answer my own question. I'm going

314
00:16:07.320 --> 00:16:10.639
in there with like five to seven cards. I know

315
00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:14.799
I'm probably not getting all five or seven, but if

316
00:16:14.840 --> 00:16:16.840
I can, you know a good percentage.

317
00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:20.639
You are listening to the sportscard Nation podcast.

318
00:16:21.279 --> 00:16:23.440
We'll be right back after this break.

319
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Hobby Hotline is the Hobby's only live, interactive call in show.

320
00:16:28.759 --> 00:16:33.080
Join some of your favorite hobby personalities every Saturday eleven

321
00:16:33.120 --> 00:16:38.240
am Eastern eight am Pacific to discuss the hottest hobby topics.

322
00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:41.840
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323
00:16:41.879 --> 00:16:46.120
on all major podcast platforms. Follow us on socials at

324
00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:50.799
Hobby Hotline.

325
00:16:50.679 --> 00:16:55.960
We om back. How much of a planner are you? John?

326
00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:56.120
Like?

327
00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:57.600
In general? Do you plan a lot?

328
00:16:57.679 --> 00:17:00.200
Or do you kind of what those a little see

329
00:17:00.320 --> 00:17:03.879
there's a little OCD there. If I guess that's how

330
00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.440
I'd answer that question. I'd rather plan. I'm not to

331
00:17:08.079 --> 00:17:11.319
you know, down to like the minute, but I like

332
00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:13.400
to have some sort of game plan.

333
00:17:13.480 --> 00:17:15.640
Maybe that's the the old coach and.

334
00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:19.279
Me where you sort of devise a game plan that sometimes,

335
00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:21.640
as you know in sports, right, you might have a

336
00:17:21.680 --> 00:17:25.039
game plan going in and you've gotta like you've got.

337
00:17:24.799 --> 00:17:26.920
To pivot and come up with a plan. B.

338
00:17:27.079 --> 00:17:30.240
But I like to have some sort of of you know,

339
00:17:30.359 --> 00:17:33.359
thought process in place of of what I'm doing this

340
00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:36.720
day or what I'm looking for this day. Right, But

341
00:17:37.000 --> 00:17:39.160
you also got to be like you said the word

342
00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:43.359
flexible right to to like be able to like, hey,

343
00:17:43.640 --> 00:17:46.400
something doesn't happen in the way you thought it was

344
00:17:46.480 --> 00:17:50.359
gonna like, you gotta pivot and flow with it.

345
00:17:50.480 --> 00:17:52.200
So like you said, I.

346
00:17:52.200 --> 00:17:54.960
Kind of I'll have a list, But you know, have

347
00:17:55.039 --> 00:17:57.960
I bought something that's sure? I think we all probably

348
00:17:57.960 --> 00:18:01.240
can say that we something just catches right, and we're like,

349
00:18:01.279 --> 00:18:03.279
you know what, that wasn't even on my radar, but

350
00:18:03.319 --> 00:18:06.240
I like it and the price was right and uh

351
00:18:06.759 --> 00:18:09.599
and now in my backpack, so uh, you know, I

352
00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:12.119
think we've all we've all done that and you shouldn't

353
00:18:12.119 --> 00:18:14.440
have to apologize for that, right, But I think you

354
00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:17.359
have to have sort of I think it's so if

355
00:18:17.400 --> 00:18:19.440
you don't go in with one and you're just too

356
00:18:19.440 --> 00:18:20.359
wide open.

357
00:18:20.119 --> 00:18:22.759
And then you get it's like being loose on the racetrack.

358
00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:24.240
No, you don't want to do that.

359
00:18:24.680 --> 00:18:26.880
You need a playbook. You need a playbook, right, like

360
00:18:26.960 --> 00:18:30.799
going with the coaching metaphor. Yeah, I might have a

361
00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:33.240
hundred plays in my playbook that I might be interested

362
00:18:33.240 --> 00:18:35.039
in running, but I'm gonna stick to my playbook. I'm

363
00:18:35.079 --> 00:18:36.720
not gonna start making up plays in the middle of

364
00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:37.000
the game.

365
00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:39.359
Yeah. Yeah, No, you're right, You're right.

366
00:18:39.640 --> 00:18:42.359
So I got to ask, you know, what your travel

367
00:18:42.440 --> 00:18:45.559
schedule look like in a in a fifty two week yere.

368
00:18:45.960 --> 00:18:49.440
I know you're busy guy, like besides traveling, but has

369
00:18:49.480 --> 00:18:51.480
it increased? You know, we talked about it, like the

370
00:18:51.559 --> 00:18:54.960
last five years, has your travel schedule increase ords it

371
00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:58.319
always been pretty it's increased busy.

372
00:18:58.000 --> 00:18:58.559
It's increased.

373
00:18:58.559 --> 00:19:00.440
And part of that is because the pandemic is over,

374
00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:04.480
So it's just there's more moving about and going out

375
00:19:04.480 --> 00:19:07.519
and doing things. But like this year, you know, we're

376
00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:12.920
not even halfway through March and we've been to Los Angeles.

377
00:19:13.799 --> 00:19:16.680
We've been all over Los Angeles, a different neighborhoods of

378
00:19:16.680 --> 00:19:19.920
Los Angeles, visiting card shops. We've been down to San Diego.

379
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:21.920
We went to the front Row Card Show down, there.

380
00:19:22.359 --> 00:19:24.559
We've been up to the Bay Area, We've been to

381
00:19:24.640 --> 00:19:27.960
card shows and shops up there. We've been over to Arizona.

382
00:19:28.160 --> 00:19:32.440
We've done stuff over in Arizona too. We've done stuff locally.

383
00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:35.720
I'm gonna be going to the Chicago Spectacular this weekend.

384
00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.480
It's been a very, very busy year so far. And

385
00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:41.079
then you know, we obviously the National is coming up,

386
00:19:41.359 --> 00:19:44.039
and it's tough like this summer, you know, it could

387
00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:46.079
be really stressful trying to do all the traveling if

388
00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:48.359
you're going to Fanatics Pest, if you're going to the National,

389
00:19:48.400 --> 00:19:50.400
if you're going out to the West Coast Card Show

390
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:52.640
that comes out a month after that, and by the way,

391
00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:54.279
we were at that, we were at the West Coast

392
00:19:54.839 --> 00:19:58.920
Card Show in Ontario, California also, So you know, there's

393
00:19:58.960 --> 00:20:01.480
a lot there's and if if you're not careful, you know,

394
00:20:01.480 --> 00:20:03.759
you can end up traveling too much or wear yourself out.

395
00:20:04.079 --> 00:20:06.599
Cause even coming into this year, we were out east,

396
00:20:06.720 --> 00:20:12.039
we were we went to the EC three show in Connecticut,

397
00:20:12.680 --> 00:20:14.759
and we were doing stuff out there that was like

398
00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:18.279
in November and December, going to shops in Connecticut and

399
00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:20.920
New York, doing that whole thing, and you know, sometimes

400
00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:23.039
your body will just tell you you need to take

401
00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:25.000
a break too, Like after this last trip, we were

402
00:20:25.000 --> 00:20:27.599
out west for two months and then you know, as

403
00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:29.279
soon as I got home, I caught a cold. Now

404
00:20:29.440 --> 00:20:31.119
you know, my body just shut down for a week

405
00:20:31.240 --> 00:20:33.680
or two. You know that can happen too, so but yeah,

406
00:20:33.680 --> 00:20:35.279
it's been a lot of traveling. Man, it's been a

407
00:20:35.319 --> 00:20:38.039
lot of traveling. And there's gonna be more. Where we

408
00:20:38.079 --> 00:20:40.599
got Arizona coming back up again in April. We got

409
00:20:40.599 --> 00:20:43.640
the Spectacular this weekend, we got the National this summer,

410
00:20:43.720 --> 00:20:45.200
and that's just the next few months.

411
00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:47.920
When you have a weekend, I don't know how many

412
00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:50.440
there are, but when you get that weekend, we're like, hey,

413
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:53.119
I don't have to be I can be home, you know,

414
00:20:53.200 --> 00:20:56.240
maybe work, maybe doing some work. Like do you enjoy

415
00:20:56.359 --> 00:20:56.920
those two?

416
00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:57.160
Is it?

417
00:20:57.480 --> 00:20:59.519
Is it like you because you maybe don't get as

418
00:20:59.559 --> 00:21:02.960
many though as you would particularly like all the time,

419
00:21:03.400 --> 00:21:06.279
Like how do you approach like that a quiet weekend?

420
00:21:06.680 --> 00:21:06.920
Yeah?

421
00:21:07.039 --> 00:21:07.240
You know?

422
00:21:07.440 --> 00:21:10.000
Or is it weird because you're busy so much?

423
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:10.200
Is it?

424
00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:12.200
Or like you don't know what you know, It's.

425
00:21:12.039 --> 00:21:16.079
Just funny because I've got one of those lifestyles where

426
00:21:16.119 --> 00:21:20.519
my work and my recreation are intertwined, you know, if

427
00:21:20.559 --> 00:21:24.960
I ever got a free afternoon, like I'm gonna want

428
00:21:24.960 --> 00:21:26.920
to go to a card shop, or I'm gonna wanna

429
00:21:27.039 --> 00:21:30.279
do some research on cards, or I'm gonna go look

430
00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:33.039
at auctions that are ending soon, or you know, I'm

431
00:21:33.079 --> 00:21:37.599
gonna make a podcast or you know, like I've been

432
00:21:37.720 --> 00:21:41.759
very fortunate that even working in the space that it

433
00:21:41.839 --> 00:21:46.200
hasn't it hasn't extinguished my excitement for doing it as

434
00:21:46.240 --> 00:21:49.039
a hobby at the same time, in fact, it almost

435
00:21:49.039 --> 00:21:51.200
reinforces it. But the one thing that I do like

436
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:53.119
to do John, Like, you know, if I'm out of

437
00:21:53.160 --> 00:21:55.319
commission because I'm sick for a few days or whatever,

438
00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:58.000
like I'll just throw on movies, man, Like I just

439
00:21:58.039 --> 00:22:00.680
watched this new movie called The Trap House with Dave

440
00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:04.079
Bautista and the other guy I can't remember his name

441
00:22:04.160 --> 00:22:07.160
right now, and now I'm like down this Dave Bautista

442
00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:07.799
rabbit hole.

443
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:08.599
I think he's great.

444
00:22:08.599 --> 00:22:10.720
You know, I always love the tough guy movies, you know,

445
00:22:10.799 --> 00:22:14.160
Like I was big on Jason Stathan movies, Vin Diesel,

446
00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:17.599
Bruce Willis, Like I love that genre, and now I

447
00:22:17.680 --> 00:22:21.799
got these Dave Bautista that's a little his filmography that

448
00:22:21.799 --> 00:22:24.240
I'm gonna start working through because I really like his stuff.

449
00:22:24.319 --> 00:22:26.079
So that's why I do. You know, if I'm blowing

450
00:22:26.119 --> 00:22:27.720
off some steam, I'll throw on him like that.

451
00:22:28.160 --> 00:22:30.559
Yeah, And it's tough, like knowing what you do and

452
00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:32.720
I know you just got over and known that's good

453
00:22:32.799 --> 00:22:36.559
to see you're feeling better. That's gonna be even tough

454
00:22:36.599 --> 00:22:40.279
because like, as you know, right while we're sick, like

455
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:41.680
stuff is still happening.

456
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:43.640
Don't stop, ye.

457
00:22:44.079 --> 00:22:46.519
Just it's like it's like work piling on the desk,

458
00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:49.400
and so obviously you can't control being sick, but you

459
00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:50.880
almost feel guilty.

460
00:22:50.559 --> 00:22:52.920
Like I'm I need to get to that, but I da't.

461
00:22:53.000 --> 00:22:55.400
I'm not. I'm not feeling it. That was when I

462
00:22:55.480 --> 00:22:55.960
get sick.

463
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:58.599
And listen, I'm older than you, so I probably get sick,

464
00:22:58.960 --> 00:23:01.880
maybe a little bit easy or more or more often.

465
00:23:02.319 --> 00:23:04.640
I'm always like, man, I can't be sick right now

466
00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:07.200
to do this or do that. And it's tough, but

467
00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:11.240
unfortunately don't get to control that. And uh, as you

468
00:23:11.319 --> 00:23:13.880
well know, health, health has got if you you know,

469
00:23:13.960 --> 00:23:16.519
health has got to come first, or you or you

470
00:23:16.640 --> 00:23:19.839
or the work won't even matter any anymore.

471
00:23:19.400 --> 00:23:22.240
You won't be in any condition to do it.

472
00:23:22.319 --> 00:23:23.559
You got to listen to your body too.

473
00:23:23.559 --> 00:23:26.319
If your body's telling you it needs a break, it

474
00:23:26.759 --> 00:23:27.960
gets the final say on that.

475
00:23:28.200 --> 00:23:30.920
So you mentioned, you know, you sort of touched around

476
00:23:30.920 --> 00:23:33.359
the edges of of you know, we've heard the term

477
00:23:33.559 --> 00:23:37.839
hobby burnout. I've done a hobby quick hits on it.

478
00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:41.359
It's something I've talked about even just in general conversation.

479
00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:43.319
You know, I have moment I've never I wouldn't say

480
00:23:43.319 --> 00:23:46.039
I've ever had so much hobby burnout because I don't

481
00:23:46.079 --> 00:23:48.759
really get to that point, Chris, like you said, because

482
00:23:48.799 --> 00:23:51.880
I love the hobby enough where like I'd really have

483
00:23:52.000 --> 00:23:54.880
to like go way over the top to ever get

484
00:23:54.880 --> 00:23:57.880
to it. But there are weekends where I say, and

485
00:23:57.880 --> 00:24:00.319
and we even talk a little bit about this before,

486
00:24:00.880 --> 00:24:02.720
there are weekends where I say, you know what, I'm

487
00:24:02.720 --> 00:24:06.359
not doing content, not looking at or listening to I'm

488
00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:09.759
not touching cards for two days, three days.

489
00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:12.799
And then I'll get back on the horse. Do you

490
00:24:12.880 --> 00:24:14.079
have moments like that or.

491
00:24:14.039 --> 00:24:16.680
Are you just too busy when you really can't even

492
00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:17.880
afford to Oh.

493
00:24:17.799 --> 00:24:21.319
No, I'll absolutely you know, if I'm like I'm tired

494
00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:23.640
of looking at this stuff, dealing with this stuff right now,

495
00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:26.240
I'll take a break. But yeah, I mean, if it

496
00:24:26.279 --> 00:24:28.440
got to a point where I was genuinely burned out,

497
00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:32.200
I would need to reconsider things, you know. And I

498
00:24:32.279 --> 00:24:34.759
know that I know that about myself, Like if it

499
00:24:34.799 --> 00:24:37.839
ever stops being fun, you know, it might be time

500
00:24:37.839 --> 00:24:41.400
to take a second look and reevaluate. So I always

501
00:24:41.480 --> 00:24:42.880
keep that in the back of my mind, you know.

502
00:24:43.119 --> 00:24:45.160
And life ain't all about having fun. It's about putting

503
00:24:45.160 --> 00:24:48.160
your head down and working and contributing and having meaning

504
00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:50.680
and so forth. And I understand that too, Like I'm

505
00:24:50.680 --> 00:24:52.559
not sitting here expect that every day is going to

506
00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:57.480
be sunshine and puppies. But you know, if overall, if

507
00:24:57.519 --> 00:24:59.680
overall the experience is starting to drain me and it's

508
00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:02.640
having a negative impact on my life, I'll start looking elsewhere.

509
00:25:02.720 --> 00:25:06.279
But unfortunately, I've never had that. I've really never had

510
00:25:06.279 --> 00:25:09.279
anything even close to that I've had. And that's different.

511
00:25:09.319 --> 00:25:12.319
Like in one of my previous professions, when I worked

512
00:25:12.319 --> 00:25:15.720
in the music industry, I loved making music as a hobby,

513
00:25:15.759 --> 00:25:18.440
and then when I went full time and professional in it,

514
00:25:18.839 --> 00:25:21.200
I liked it for a while, but I started to

515
00:25:21.240 --> 00:25:23.400
lose the passion because so much of the work I

516
00:25:23.519 --> 00:25:24.599
was doing was.

517
00:25:24.559 --> 00:25:25.920
At the direction of other people.

518
00:25:26.160 --> 00:25:29.359
You know, like you need to make me some compose

519
00:25:29.440 --> 00:25:31.440
some stuff for me that sounds like this, or I

520
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:33.359
don't really like how you mixed this. I want the

521
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:35.920
vocals to be louder and the kick drum to be lower.

522
00:25:36.279 --> 00:25:38.240
And after a while it's just like, well, I'm just

523
00:25:38.319 --> 00:25:40.799
kind of a machine. I'm just doing other people's bidding.

524
00:25:41.119 --> 00:25:43.759
I really am not having a creative outlet. And I

525
00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:46.240
think I carried some of those lessons over into working

526
00:25:46.279 --> 00:25:48.880
into this space to where I sort of built a

527
00:25:49.000 --> 00:25:52.319
moat around myself that lets me be creative, lets me

528
00:25:52.440 --> 00:25:55.119
sort of work on my own terms, to some extent.

529
00:25:55.200 --> 00:25:56.680
But also at the end of the day, when you're

530
00:25:56.720 --> 00:26:00.240
providing a service, every customer is your boss. You know,

531
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:02.759
if somebody has a complaint or an issue or a question,

532
00:26:03.160 --> 00:26:05.200
I have to step up or somebody on my team

533
00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:07.599
is going to step up and we're going to address it.

534
00:26:07.720 --> 00:26:09.920
You know, that's our job. That's part of you know,

535
00:26:10.039 --> 00:26:12.880
running a decent business. So you know, it all kind

536
00:26:12.880 --> 00:26:16.480
of plays together and and uh and works itself together there.

537
00:26:16.519 --> 00:26:19.039
But you know, burnout's a real thing, and then there's

538
00:26:19.079 --> 00:26:21.920
something else, there's another side of the coin, so you

539
00:26:21.960 --> 00:26:25.759
can get burnt out. But my buddy Curtis brought this

540
00:26:25.880 --> 00:26:27.720
up to me the other day when we were talking.

541
00:26:28.079 --> 00:26:31.440
There's the opposite of burnout, which is which is like addiction,

542
00:26:31.960 --> 00:26:35.480
or you're over indulging in the hobby and you're spending

543
00:26:35.559 --> 00:26:38.680
too much and it's taken away from your time, it's

544
00:26:38.680 --> 00:26:41.319
taken away from spending time with your family and your

545
00:26:41.359 --> 00:26:44.519
loved ones, or it's taken away from your professional responsibilities

546
00:26:44.599 --> 00:26:46.880
or your other duties in life. And then that can

547
00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:49.720
be a problem too, where it's the opposite of burnout.

548
00:26:49.759 --> 00:26:52.559
You're doing too much. You're burning the candle on both ends,

549
00:26:52.799 --> 00:26:55.880
and that can be something that might need to get

550
00:26:55.920 --> 00:27:00.599
regulated also, you know, so we have to moderate ourselves

551
00:27:00.599 --> 00:27:03.680
on all the extremes. And and I could be maybe

552
00:27:03.720 --> 00:27:07.000
more susceptible to over indulging, to just making the hobby

553
00:27:07.039 --> 00:27:10.000
too much of my life and not having a balance.

554
00:27:10.200 --> 00:27:12.240
So having a balance is really important too, John.

555
00:27:12.359 --> 00:27:15.079
Yeah, and I'm glad you mentioned like the addiction part

556
00:27:15.119 --> 00:27:18.720
because and hopefully that you know this isn't someone out

557
00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:22.119
there where you know where it's unhealthy, right, there's there's

558
00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:25.359
good things, right Listen, you could be doing something really

559
00:27:25.440 --> 00:27:28.880
terrible or illegal and that sort of thing. Right, But

560
00:27:29.039 --> 00:27:33.440
like anything right, anything can be addicting depending on how

561
00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:35.880
much you do it or where it becomes, where it

562
00:27:36.079 --> 00:27:40.079
starts affecting not just yourself but other people or relations.

563
00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:40.319
Right.

564
00:27:40.359 --> 00:27:43.480
And sometimes sometimes when you're in that you may not

565
00:27:43.519 --> 00:27:46.640
even realize. It takes someone else to say, hey, you

566
00:27:46.680 --> 00:27:49.480
know you miss this or where were you for the

567
00:27:49.559 --> 00:27:50.960
birthday party? Right?

568
00:27:51.079 --> 00:27:51.839
You know whatever.

569
00:27:51.920 --> 00:27:54.400
I'm just bringing up stuff off the top of my head.

570
00:27:54.440 --> 00:27:57.559
But stuff like that is where it can go. Like

571
00:27:57.640 --> 00:28:01.039
you said, it's there's two sides to that coin as well.

572
00:28:01.160 --> 00:28:04.359
So it's a good point that you brought up as well.

573
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:07.039
And you know, I think we've all had moments. I

574
00:28:07.039 --> 00:28:09.480
think we've all had days where, like I tell a

575
00:28:09.599 --> 00:28:13.200
lot of stuff hobby wise today and but it's when

576
00:28:13.240 --> 00:28:16.359
those days start to run together where maybe that becomes

577
00:28:16.559 --> 00:28:19.920
more of an issue one day, if you But you know,

578
00:28:20.079 --> 00:28:23.200
like I said, I've had weekends where I'm like two

579
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:26.400
or three days like I'm just I'm gonna take a break.

580
00:28:26.599 --> 00:28:30.480
And when I've done that, Chris, it's the old cliche saying, right,

581
00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:33.599
absence makes the heart grow fund Taking those couple of

582
00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:37.440
days off, I'm like excited to get back, right, I'm

583
00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:41.160
like I'm mitching or chopping at the bits as they say.

584
00:28:41.240 --> 00:28:43.319
So that's all we do it with my collection, John,

585
00:28:43.640 --> 00:28:46.079
is that I make sure to not just sit and

586
00:28:46.160 --> 00:28:49.200
stare at it all day, but I make it a reward.

587
00:28:49.400 --> 00:28:52.200
Like you know, I'm not going to force myself.

588
00:28:51.880 --> 00:28:54.000
To go enjoy my cards only when I'm like, oh,

589
00:28:54.039 --> 00:28:55.519
you know what would be a nice break right now

590
00:28:55.559 --> 00:28:57.599
if I could thumb through the collection, and then I'll

591
00:28:57.640 --> 00:29:00.440
go do it and I won't overdo it, put them

592
00:29:00.440 --> 00:29:03.079
back away, and then we'll come back in a week

593
00:29:03.200 --> 00:29:04.200
or however long it.

594
00:29:04.599 --> 00:29:06.720
Yeah, and why not? Am I right?

595
00:29:06.759 --> 00:29:06.839
You?

596
00:29:07.079 --> 00:29:09.880
Like I say one of my mantras, Right, you built

597
00:29:09.920 --> 00:29:12.119
your collection and be proud of it. Right, you should

598
00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:15.359
have those moments where you go through and say yeah.

599
00:29:15.400 --> 00:29:18.319
And besides even the cards itselves, you know there's something

600
00:29:18.440 --> 00:29:22.160
quiet but even the stories behind the acquisition. I remember

601
00:29:22.519 --> 00:29:25.240
how I got this card, I remember what show was,

602
00:29:25.319 --> 00:29:29.079
I remember who was from, I remember the negotiations and

603
00:29:29.319 --> 00:29:32.519
this funny moment or whatever. Whatever card has a different

604
00:29:32.559 --> 00:29:36.039
story to tell. So it's even even looking at the

605
00:29:36.079 --> 00:29:39.799
card and then thinking about the backstories behind the cards.

606
00:29:40.119 --> 00:29:43.559
I think that's important as well, and sometimes we forget

607
00:29:43.559 --> 00:29:46.839
about that. I always say, like, it's the acquisition is great,

608
00:29:46.880 --> 00:29:50.000
and that's obviously the endgame, but don't forget about the

609
00:29:50.119 --> 00:29:53.400
journey along the way to get that, whatever that act

610
00:29:53.559 --> 00:29:57.279
was may be, whether it's an individual card, a whole set,

611
00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:00.799
you know, that sort of it's important. I think we

612
00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:04.079
appreciate it more when we think along those terms rather

613
00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:06.880
than you know, with some people like, oh, look at

614
00:30:06.880 --> 00:30:09.920
this ten thousand dollars card, you know, which is great

615
00:30:09.960 --> 00:30:12.039
and not wrong with that to each their own. But

616
00:30:12.960 --> 00:30:15.839
it's more than just to me anyway, and I know

617
00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:19.559
to you it's more than just a dollar sign of value.

618
00:30:19.880 --> 00:30:20.480
It's got to be.

619
00:30:20.599 --> 00:30:23.839
That's that's that's how I find collecting to be sustainable.

620
00:30:23.960 --> 00:30:27.319
Always awesome having chris On, Like I said in the intro,

621
00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:29.920
one of the things I love about having Chris On

622
00:30:30.200 --> 00:30:34.839
is he's not afraid to turn the tables during his

623
00:30:35.400 --> 00:30:38.720
the conversation and ask hey, John, what do you think

624
00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:40.359
of this? Or are you like this?

625
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:41.559
Or what do you think?

626
00:30:42.079 --> 00:30:45.920
And that's always refreshing. I always appreciate that, right, you

627
00:30:45.960 --> 00:30:48.359
almost feel like you don't have to carry the conversation,

628
00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:50.880
not that I have to a lot of times. I

629
00:30:51.000 --> 00:30:55.359
probably do sometimes when I shouldn't. But he always will

630
00:30:56.039 --> 00:30:59.160
make you think or ask you, hey, what's your view

631
00:30:59.200 --> 00:31:03.319
on that approach? Or are you like this? And that's

632
00:31:03.319 --> 00:31:08.039
always fun, especially when you don't necessarily know that's coming.

633
00:31:08.279 --> 00:31:12.880
And I always like that about him. He's a great

634
00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:16.680
on his own shows and and he's a great conversationalist.

635
00:31:17.119 --> 00:31:20.000
But more importantly, he's a great guy. And uh so

636
00:31:20.279 --> 00:31:24.200
uh in the hobby's better with him in it. So uh,

637
00:31:24.720 --> 00:31:26.799
we're not done with Krush yet. We're gonna have part

638
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:31.240
two uh next week uh as well to finish up

639
00:31:32.359 --> 00:31:35.000
our great and interesting conversation.

640
00:31:35.400 --> 00:31:39.240
Time for our hobby is the People Announcer of the Week.

641
00:31:42.400 --> 00:31:46.279
Hello collectors, This is a cream from Sacred Home Sports Cards.

642
00:31:46.640 --> 00:31:48.839
Remember the hobby is the people.

643
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:51.599
If you'd like to be the Hobby is the People

644
00:31:51.640 --> 00:31:54.839
Announcer of the Week to one or m P three

645
00:31:54.920 --> 00:31:59.039
file and send it to Sportscott Nation DC at gmail

646
00:31:59.240 --> 00:32:01.079
dot com.