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Sept. 4, 2026

Steve Grad is Back! E404

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Steve Grad is back and we cover some hobby ground on this episode.


Talking Points may include:

*Where it all started.

*Whats in his PC, Favorites and selling.

*Secretary and Clubbie autos-What you need to know.


*Percentage of autos that are fake in the wild.

*Scenario-You see a slabbed auto but you know it's not legit.


*Most Forged?

*Going completely under his own brand.


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WEBVTT

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Sports Card Nation, the hobby is the people. Weekly news

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and interviews, it's your number one source. Sports Card Nation,

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the hobby is the people. Sports Card Nation.

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What is up everybody? Welcome to episode 404 of Sports

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Card Nation podcast. Let's get our Our thank you is

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out of the way. I want to thank our great sponsors, SGC,

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Iron Sports Cards, SCD, Sports Collectors Digest, Hobby Hotline, Upper Deck,

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Card Ladder, and the Certified Trading Card Association, CTCA. All right.

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Steve Grant is back. Part two of our great conversation

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with probably the leading autograph authenticator, in the industry or

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one of them he's right there and lots of experience

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and I'm you know I'm going to ask him like

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I did in the first episode last week or the

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first half last week we're going to lean on his

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expertise and knows his stuff and so I like to

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I like to pick brains of people who know their

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stuff that sounded weird but you know what I meant

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so All right, with that being said, let's get the

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show started.

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Attention, Sports Card Nation viewers.

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What up, kids?

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It's your boy Scott Hanson from NFL Red Zone.

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Oh, we're back. Ball is back. The hobby never ends.

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And before you know it, I'm going to be on

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your screen again, rocking that octobox, knocking the bottom out

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of the witching hour, and announcing seven hours of Red

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Zone football. But as you watch Red Zone, just save

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some time. Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, to check

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out John... and Sports Card Nation. Let's have a great season, people.

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I got a question. Sure. Someone shows you an autographed

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card that's slabbed. But whatever company, it doesn't even matter.

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They're there. And it's certified by that company, and you're

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looking at it. Somehow they showed it to you. And

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you know, like, hey, this is not– I know what

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it says on the flip, but I got to be

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the bearer of bad news, right? This is not, in

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my honest opinion and expert opinion, I don't believe this

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is a rare Player A autograph. How do you handle

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that when, like, it's already– You know, it's already like

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in the population reports. It's already slab. I'm sure they

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believe you. I mean, most of the time.

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Right.

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Like what what do you recommend they do in a

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case like that? Or what or what can you do even?

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I mean, I've I've done some stuff on online, you know,

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gone on Twitter and talked about it. I've definitely commented

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on it. When I see something that's wrong, I want

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people to know, you know, and there are mistakes by. Listen,

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I'll go back to this one. remark, John, is that like,

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there's no perfection in authentication there. It doesn't exist. There

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you go. You don't want to be, you don't want

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to be somebody that's perfect. I mean, it's nice to

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be perfect and get it all right all the time,

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but mistakes are going to happen. Things will get through.

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I always tell people that I always reference to ballplayers who,

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who were great at their position, Ozzie Smith, Brooks Robinson.

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I mean, essentially those guys never made errors. I mean,

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but they did and it happened. But, you know, you've

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got the human vacuum cleaner there. You've got the wizard

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at shortstop. And those guys were really good at what

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they did. And, you know, they were great defenders. And

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at the same time, as an autograph authenticator, I feel

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that I'm the same way. And I feel I'm very

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good at this job. I've gotten to a great position.

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But I'm not infallible. I can make mistakes and mess

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things up. And that goes for what you were saying

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about the companies, too. So you've got, you know, PSA.

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You've got JSA. You've got Beckett. Those are the big

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three that do holder stuff. And there's stuff that I

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do see that I kind of disagree with that I

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don't hold back anymore. I did when I was at Beckett.

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And then PSA wouldn't want me talking about any of

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that anyway. And I've been gone from PSA for 10 years.

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Do they make mistakes too? Yes. Yeah. And everybody does.

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They're human. And it does happen. But sometimes I do

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go point them out and let them know. But at

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the end of the day, I don't think they do

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much about it. Pretty sure they're just going to keep

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going on as business as usual. And at the same time, John,

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I'm not trying to destroy someone else's livelihood. But I

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think it's important to educate people on, hey, maybe you

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don't want to spend a quarter million on this card

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because it's not what it really is. And I can

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point it out a lot. I did a video, I

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want to say on my YouTube channel back in May.

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And listen, I didn't have to get involved in this,

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but I got dragged into it on X on Twitter.

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And it was about the perfect pair, about the shoe

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collector in California who has this incredible shoe collection, tens

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of millions of dollars, rare stuff, great stuff. But he's

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also got autograph stuff, and he claims to have one

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of the shoes Jordan wore when he made the shot

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against Utah in the last finals he played in. But

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one of those shoes, so Jordan had given one to

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the PR guy, the Bulls, and he had all six shoes,

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one shoe each from every last final game Jordan gave

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to him. Those sold in Sotheby's were crazy numbers, six

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million or what. And he claims to have another shoe

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that was worn by Jordan that night. But the autographs

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were all, they're all garbage. And he has another shoe

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from a game that was like two games before that.

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Same thing. All bad. But I didn't talk to the guy.

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I just did a video based on what I saw. And,

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you know, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to look

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at the picture of it. And I know it's no good. And,

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you know, he's still standing behind it, obviously, and he's

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not happy the video is out there, but. Um, I

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told him, I said, at the end of the day,

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here's what you should do. Come to the national and

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go visit. You've got three big companies there. Go submit

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it to every single one and see what they say.

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Then take that and submit it for photo match and

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see what happens. Cause I can tell you, you're going

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to be disappointed because nothing's going to match up. You're

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going to end up, you know, you end up, if

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you have the money, which he's very boisterous about having money,

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then just go spend it. You're going to lose it.

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But at the same time, you'll know the truth.

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Yeah.

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I wonder sometimes, and I don't want to speak for

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this individual. I don't know him. You know, sometimes I

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wonder if maybe internally they sort of have their own

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doubts and they just don't want to know. You know

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what I mean? As crazy as that might sound, they're like, well,

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if I don't try to find out, then I won't

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know something bad. You know what I mean? It's like

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someone maybe being ill and they're like, I'm not going

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to the physician or I just keep going as long as.

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you know, for as long as I can.

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It's right. He's been on this hit streak with those

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shoes forever. Cause he's been talking about them for 10,

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12 years. I mean, at this point in time, he's,

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you know, he's on that Hill. He's not getting off.

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He's he's there. He's on top. And he's like, no,

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they're good. I feel they're good. But at the end

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of the day, I I've seen videos, many, there's tons

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of videos on the shoes and they're just complete garbage.

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And it would be hard for anybody to deny it.

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When you look, when you start matching exemplars, and that's

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the important thing to do too, is like, I'm going

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to demonstrate to you why these are no good. I'll

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show you. And I'm going to show you the reasons

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why they're no good. And I like doing that. And

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I do like to point out stuff.

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Yeah, and you're not just telling someone, hey, that's bad

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or that's not authentic. You're explaining how you came to

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that conclusion.

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Exactly.

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You did the math and you're showing them how you

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got to that answer, not just giving them the answer.

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But like you said, maybe some people don't. Don't want

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to hear the answer. Don't know the answer. Maybe don't

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want to hear it.

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What was the great line in Jack Nicholson? A few

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good men you can't handle. You can't handle the truth.

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And I don't think people and listen, I've spent all

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these years in this business and a lot of people

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still can't handle the truth. We just had recently someone

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used our autograph review at gradcollection.com and he put in like,

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I think eight or 12 items and they were all terrible.

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they were awful. And you know, they were, they were

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Jordan and mantle and all the big names are all terrible.

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He emails us saying, I want a complete refund. My

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stuff was a hundred percent genuine. And I was like, okay,

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whatever you say, no problem. This stuff wasn't, it was

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really bad, but he can't handle the truth. So that's,

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there's a lot of those in our business.

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Yeah. It's tough. And obviously sometimes you get caught in

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the middle of that. Is there an athlete or celebrity

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that even as an authenticator, like, that really puts you

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through the task. Like this is going to be like the,

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I guess I'm asking you in a long winded way

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is like, which, which person gives you even, even with

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your expertise, like you really have to like work to,

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to make sure, you know, one side of the other,

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like it's real or it's not, but gives you the

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most trouble getting to that.

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Well, not, not to lump them all together, but I

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think that the, the modern Sharpie stuff is tough. You know,

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you have to think about this way. If you go back,

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to let's just say even, you know, let's go back

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to the thirties. You had fountain pens, you had pencil,

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but mostly fountain pens. And then late forties, early fifties,

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you start moving your way into ballpoint pens and then

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roller writers and markers and laundry markers and all this stuff.

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The more the markers have got advanced, I think the

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tougher it is. You see less pen strokes, you see

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less overlapping and you've seen it. I don't have to

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tell you, you know, these guys scribble, you know, I mean,

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most modern athletes, musicians, celebrities, they just scribble. So it's

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really hard, you know, when you start looking and saying

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someone says, Oh, this is Hugh Jackman's autograph. And it's

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literally like a loop in a line, you know, Al Pacino,

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when he was rushing Al Pacino would give you a

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check mark or a circle. Like it's hard to say, yeah,

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that's their autograph conclusively. So I think a lot of

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that stuff does give people issues from an authentication standpoint.

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A lot of times it, my, my personal thing is

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you just push it away because it's almost impossible to

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support it. You know what I mean? You can't, you

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can't really support scribble. It's very difficult. Now I know

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how certain people sign, but they've always signed that way.

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And I could accept that like Jonah Hill from when

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he was, you know, first in Hollywood till now, it's

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just a complete scribble thing and he's always done it. But,

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It's hard to justify some of the scribble I see.

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You'd look at Hugh Jackman as a great example. Again,

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he did a signing. Those were all nice. Then you

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look at an in-person Hugh Jackman, and you're like, huh?

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It's like nothing. So I think when you start looking

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at those autographs, those could be trouble. And listen, I

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could put a million people in that group. They're all scribblers,

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so they're tough to authenticate.

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Listening to you explain that, and I fully get it,

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Can you almost say like the scribble autos? I almost

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can't authenticate because like, how do you do it? Like,

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you know, I've, I've gotten autographed. I remember getting autographed

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Steve when I was a kid at a baseball game. And,

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you know, there's a line of us kids and they're

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just grabbing the card quick and just, you know, it's

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real quick. It's like you said, it's different than a

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setting where they're not rushed or they're not trying to

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get out of there. And I've gotten cards autographed by players.

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And then I see, another auto that's a lot nicer.

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And I'm like, it's not, not necessarily we get certified,

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but I'm like, if I was, I wouldn't pass this.

227
00:11:48.620 --> 00:11:51.000
And I know it's real. Cause I, I was there

228
00:11:51.220 --> 00:11:53.620
and handed to him and he handed it back. But

229
00:11:53.679 --> 00:11:57.789
because of the rushing or the, you know, not, not

230
00:11:57.850 --> 00:12:00.990
the attention to detail that may might do at another,

231
00:12:01.110 --> 00:12:04.549
a real signing at a show where they're getting paid

232
00:12:04.610 --> 00:12:07.580
and they're at the table. Both autographs are real, but

233
00:12:07.720 --> 00:12:13.669
one is obviously nicer looking, easier to obviously authenticate. It's

234
00:12:13.750 --> 00:12:16.350
almost like the scribble ones you can. And then I'll

235
00:12:16.409 --> 00:12:18.750
add on top of that, and I'm sure you've seen this,

236
00:12:19.090 --> 00:12:22.049
we're seeing a lot of the newer players, these younger players, right?

237
00:12:22.470 --> 00:12:26.289
Cursive is really not taught in school, unfortunately. And they

238
00:12:26.379 --> 00:12:30.279
just put like they're literally they print initials like Mom

239
00:12:30.320 --> 00:12:34.860
John Newman. If I was younger, I might just put JN.

240
00:12:35.220 --> 00:12:37.500
And you see a lot of those on these certified

241
00:12:37.620 --> 00:12:40.669
autos that are coming out of packs that way. And, like,

242
00:12:40.789 --> 00:12:44.289
I can replicate that. I'm not even good at– I

243
00:12:44.509 --> 00:12:46.690
wouldn't be good at that, but I can even do

244
00:12:46.730 --> 00:12:50.799
that much. You almost can't certify other than unless they

245
00:12:50.840 --> 00:12:53.019
were in front of you and you say that is

246
00:12:53.039 --> 00:12:55.639
their autograph because I witnessed them signing it.

247
00:12:55.759 --> 00:12:58.600
I'm trying to think. Like Caleb Williams, who plays for–

248
00:12:58.700 --> 00:13:01.500
I'm a Bears fan, but his autograph is pretty awful.

249
00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:04.450
I mean, it's CW, maybe a C sometimes, and that's it.

250
00:13:04.850 --> 00:13:06.750
And you talked about the initials. I think the kid

251
00:13:06.789 --> 00:13:09.360
who– is that was the first round pick in the NBA.

252
00:13:09.559 --> 00:13:11.620
I saw that like the first auto he signed, it was,

253
00:13:12.080 --> 00:13:14.480
it was horrible and he's taken his time and that's

254
00:13:14.519 --> 00:13:17.519
what he's signing or the, the Raiders quarterback that just,

255
00:13:17.539 --> 00:13:19.259
they just drafted. Same thing. I just saw some of

256
00:13:19.279 --> 00:13:21.019
his stuff and I'm like, this is, this.

257
00:13:20.980 --> 00:13:22.620
Is, yeah.

258
00:13:22.710 --> 00:13:25.990
And Ash and Jenty, same thing. Like his autograph, the

259
00:13:26.009 --> 00:13:28.970
first signing he did signed really tiny on stuff. He'd signed,

260
00:13:29.289 --> 00:13:31.149
you know, these big full-size helmets and he just signed

261
00:13:31.190 --> 00:13:35.009
really tiny and it's a terrible signature anyway. It's, that

262
00:13:35.049 --> 00:13:37.370
stuff is really tough to go near and authenticate because,

263
00:13:37.879 --> 00:13:40.019
Who knows? I mean, did the athlete sign it? Did

264
00:13:40.120 --> 00:13:41.940
they send them the cards to do it? But their

265
00:13:41.980 --> 00:13:45.059
autographs are just nothing. You've seen them. I know you have.

266
00:13:45.100 --> 00:13:48.210
I've seen them online where someone will illustrate someone's signature.

267
00:13:48.230 --> 00:13:50.250
I'm like, what is this? It looks like a checkmark

268
00:13:50.549 --> 00:13:52.590
or maybe you just drew a little line or a squiggle.

269
00:13:52.889 --> 00:13:55.629
The soccer players signed terrible. You know, back if I

270
00:13:55.669 --> 00:13:58.049
go back to like the 80s collecting in person, the

271
00:13:58.090 --> 00:14:00.750
guys who usually had the worst autographs were hockey. They

272
00:14:00.769 --> 00:14:03.629
were all scribble. Then it you know, then baseball was better.

273
00:14:03.730 --> 00:14:06.490
Usually in football now, they're just all. brutal i've seen

274
00:14:06.529 --> 00:14:08.710
the yeah now it's terrible.

275
00:14:08.549 --> 00:14:11.409
It's all it's all to me they're rushing like you'll

276
00:14:11.470 --> 00:14:13.710
even see some of the athletes post on their social

277
00:14:13.750 --> 00:14:16.169
media and they got the cards all laid out in

278
00:14:16.240 --> 00:14:18.720
front of them and they're just they sometimes they'll even

279
00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:23.779
comment like gotta get through this uh asap or quick

280
00:14:23.860 --> 00:14:26.500
and so they're you know they're they're rushing through them

281
00:14:26.990 --> 00:14:29.789
I almost think with the scribble or the initial autos,

282
00:14:29.850 --> 00:14:33.259
the only way those really can be certified is there's

283
00:14:33.299 --> 00:14:35.059
a witness like there.

284
00:14:35.139 --> 00:14:35.539
Exactly.

285
00:14:35.559 --> 00:14:39.039
It just says, listen, I was there. It wasn't, listen,

286
00:14:39.080 --> 00:14:41.539
it ain't a pretty auto, but it is his or

287
00:14:41.580 --> 00:14:43.539
her auto.

288
00:14:43.740 --> 00:14:44.820
Well, I had done.

289
00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:45.360
Yeah.

290
00:14:45.379 --> 00:14:47.320
And that's a great point you made because I had

291
00:14:47.379 --> 00:14:51.870
done Ben Affleck's first signing and Ben Affleck came in

292
00:14:51.879 --> 00:14:53.230
and he said, I'm going to, I'm going to do

293
00:14:53.250 --> 00:14:56.830
my nice autograph, not my street scribble. And, Before you

294
00:14:56.870 --> 00:14:59.870
knew it, during that signing, two or three hours, he

295
00:15:00.330 --> 00:15:04.309
had signed 25 different ways. Whatever he signed at the

296
00:15:04.350 --> 00:15:08.120
beginning was nothing what he signed at the end. They

297
00:15:08.129 --> 00:15:10.600
were all nice in a way, but you had to

298
00:15:10.639 --> 00:15:12.980
have him witnessed because people would be like, hold on

299
00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:17.000
a minute. He's got 20 different signatures in this signing.

300
00:15:17.320 --> 00:15:19.279
I went and did a video for the client and

301
00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:21.580
I put it on Instagram because they wanted people to

302
00:15:21.620 --> 00:15:24.279
know like, hey, we were there. Beckett was there witnessing it,

303
00:15:24.440 --> 00:15:26.529
but I will tell you, he was all over the

304
00:15:26.549 --> 00:15:29.570
board and guys do that at signings. It's very strange.

305
00:15:29.830 --> 00:15:31.929
Just settle down and just sign one way.

306
00:15:32.190 --> 00:15:34.169
Yeah. And it makes, like you said, it makes your

307
00:15:34.210 --> 00:15:37.110
life difficult. And I think at some point with certain,

308
00:15:37.250 --> 00:15:40.750
especially like the, just the initial ones where anyone can

309
00:15:40.850 --> 00:15:43.909
do that, potentially, I almost think those have to be

310
00:15:43.950 --> 00:15:47.269
in front of someone that can just verify, like, listen,

311
00:15:47.710 --> 00:15:50.750
it's not, it's not, it's not a pretty signature, but

312
00:15:50.929 --> 00:15:52.830
it's his or her. I was here.

313
00:15:52.990 --> 00:15:53.169
So.

314
00:15:53.710 --> 00:15:57.250
You know, that sort of thing. But yeah, I get it.

315
00:15:57.250 --> 00:16:00.889
Time for a quick break. But we'll be right back.

316
00:16:04.559 --> 00:16:08.039
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317
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318
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319
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325
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326
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327
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You know, if you collect vintage autograph stuff, you know,

328
00:17:03.639 --> 00:17:07.569
those of us that know about it, right? the clubby signature,

329
00:17:07.609 --> 00:17:12.950
the secretarials, how good were those folks at replicating the

330
00:17:13.069 --> 00:17:16.690
athlete signatures that they were, they were doing and how,

331
00:17:16.710 --> 00:17:19.750
in other words, how, how, how tricky is it for

332
00:17:19.789 --> 00:17:21.650
you to spot or, or not, not really?

333
00:17:22.069 --> 00:17:24.549
Uh, I'd say that the, you know, the, obviously the,

334
00:17:24.690 --> 00:17:26.609
you always go to the Yankees first and, you know,

335
00:17:26.630 --> 00:17:29.970
they had guys signing, not really Ruth that much, very rarely.

336
00:17:30.009 --> 00:17:34.119
And Garrick occasionally, But, you know, DiMaggio and Mantle, clubhouse guys,

337
00:17:34.140 --> 00:17:37.750
especially throughout Mantle's whole career after the Triple Crown, you know,

338
00:17:37.789 --> 00:17:40.349
by 56 or so, it was mostly just clubhouse stuff

339
00:17:40.390 --> 00:17:44.150
coming out. He occasionally signed his mail when he was

340
00:17:44.269 --> 00:17:46.750
early on, just ever so occasionally. You know, maybe a

341
00:17:47.210 --> 00:17:49.569
hit or miss here because, you know, I see government postcards.

342
00:17:49.710 --> 00:17:51.829
So that tells me someone sent to him somewhere, but

343
00:17:51.849 --> 00:17:53.519
it could have been on the road. It could have

344
00:17:53.539 --> 00:17:55.460
been sent to a ballpark, you know, that he was

345
00:17:55.519 --> 00:17:58.630
visiting or if he's in Washington or Chicago. But when

346
00:17:58.650 --> 00:18:01.400
you start seeing GPCs, you know, somebody's probably signing their

347
00:18:01.440 --> 00:18:04.839
mail at some point. Mantle's a good one, but the

348
00:18:04.880 --> 00:18:07.380
clubhouse guys are always out there. They've been around forever.

349
00:18:07.559 --> 00:18:09.140
And I think the funniest story I could tell you

350
00:18:09.480 --> 00:18:13.950
about clubhouse signatures is in the late 60s, early to

351
00:18:13.990 --> 00:18:18.650
mid 70s, the Tigers hired, did something really unique because

352
00:18:18.690 --> 00:18:20.890
the Tigers had, you know, pretty decent teams back there

353
00:18:20.950 --> 00:18:23.670
and some decent names back in the late 60s, 70s,

354
00:18:23.710 --> 00:18:29.250
but they hired current felons that were forgers. And they

355
00:18:29.289 --> 00:18:32.839
would sign the baseballs for the team. And I see

356
00:18:32.859 --> 00:18:35.700
those all the time. And it's the whole team, all

357
00:18:35.740 --> 00:18:37.880
in different inks. So one guy or two guys would

358
00:18:37.900 --> 00:18:39.940
work on two different players and they would sign them

359
00:18:39.980 --> 00:18:41.680
on the balls. But all the team balls that were

360
00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:44.829
given away back then usually were no good. Like 68

361
00:18:44.829 --> 00:18:48.269
Tigers were done by guys sitting in a prison. They

362
00:18:48.289 --> 00:18:50.809
weren't done by the players. I mean, there's real ones,

363
00:18:51.210 --> 00:18:54.170
but there's ones that were just literally signed by all

364
00:18:54.619 --> 00:18:57.240
they're all cons signing the team balls. So I don't

365
00:18:57.259 --> 00:18:59.619
know if a lot of people know that, but you know, and,

366
00:19:00.059 --> 00:19:03.339
and that the clubhouse thing is, is stayed steady. Now,

367
00:19:03.359 --> 00:19:05.309
do I see it a lot currently? No, because we,

368
00:19:05.900 --> 00:19:07.609
you know, quite truthfully, you don't see a lot of

369
00:19:07.619 --> 00:19:10.210
team balls anymore. It's pretty rare and it doesn't happen.

370
00:19:10.829 --> 00:19:13.470
And I'd say that that fad is almost gone now

371
00:19:13.670 --> 00:19:16.069
amongst teams. Like maybe there's a handful here or there,

372
00:19:16.450 --> 00:19:18.630
but they don't really do a lot of team balls anymore. And,

373
00:19:19.240 --> 00:19:22.240
Even back in the 90s, early 2000s, you saw clubhouse

374
00:19:22.259 --> 00:19:24.819
stuff come out. You know, Barry Bonds almost always, you know,

375
00:19:24.839 --> 00:19:27.880
with the Giants or Pirates or other, you know, he

376
00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:30.059
would have somebody sign for him. So that stuff did happen.

377
00:19:31.079 --> 00:19:33.859
It's interesting to see how that evolution has gone on.

378
00:19:34.240 --> 00:19:36.640
We know that people sign for celebrities all the time.

379
00:19:36.680 --> 00:19:39.440
People sign for sports players all the time. If you're

380
00:19:39.480 --> 00:19:42.079
mailing something, you have to know there's a good chance

381
00:19:42.119 --> 00:19:44.960
they might not actually sign. You know, if you're sending

382
00:19:44.980 --> 00:19:47.369
it to Dan Castellaneta, who does the voice of Homer Simpson,

383
00:19:47.390 --> 00:19:49.220
you're going to get it back signed. But if you're

384
00:19:49.240 --> 00:19:51.650
sending to Aaron Jones, he's probably never going to see

385
00:19:51.670 --> 00:19:53.450
your letter or see anything you had to do with it.

386
00:19:54.609 --> 00:19:58.210
Yeah, it's a good point. Even at home, maybe a

387
00:19:58.269 --> 00:20:01.970
wife signs it or they have a personal assistant that's

388
00:20:02.059 --> 00:20:04.880
in their repertoire. Heck, like you said, the Tigers hired

389
00:20:05.279 --> 00:20:09.130
convicts to be mickey lolich and friends you know.

390
00:20:09.069 --> 00:20:10.430
They did it you know and don't you know don't

391
00:20:10.450 --> 00:20:13.009
forget you mentioned that that was very prevalent with hall

392
00:20:13.029 --> 00:20:15.890
of famers you know um yeah you send a red

393
00:20:15.930 --> 00:20:18.410
favor in the mail red favors wife would you send

394
00:20:18.470 --> 00:20:20.809
earl combs in the mail earl combs wife would sign

395
00:20:20.849 --> 00:20:22.369
it and on and on and it kind of went

396
00:20:22.410 --> 00:20:24.569
like that with a lot of those type of players

397
00:20:24.630 --> 00:20:28.130
because they were besieged by mail at times and they

398
00:20:28.150 --> 00:20:30.170
just couldn't do it all i mean jimmy fox's brother

399
00:20:30.230 --> 00:20:33.470
would sign for him roger hornsby had a girlfriend back

400
00:20:33.509 --> 00:20:35.210
in the mid-50s that would sign all of his mail

401
00:20:35.289 --> 00:20:38.160
so that stuff happens and it's been happening for a

402
00:20:38.180 --> 00:20:40.880
long time, you know, because they just can't handle it

403
00:20:40.900 --> 00:20:42.759
or don't want to do it all. And I've seen

404
00:20:42.829 --> 00:20:45.230
it happen throughout the years. I'm just about everybody.

405
00:20:45.470 --> 00:20:49.910
Yeah. We're coming down the home stretch. Steve talk about

406
00:20:50.509 --> 00:20:53.390
you're not new, obviously the industry, but you, you, you're

407
00:20:53.450 --> 00:20:55.910
on your own now kind of talk about, you know,

408
00:20:56.099 --> 00:21:00.119
what you provide, what you do. Obviously we already talked

409
00:21:00.140 --> 00:21:04.259
to you doing like educational stuff, your videos in YouTube, but,

410
00:21:04.920 --> 00:21:08.640
even on the professional level, like the stuff that you

411
00:21:08.740 --> 00:21:12.089
offer and now being your own guy, right? Like you said,

412
00:21:12.130 --> 00:21:15.630
you have your two main operations with your wife. So,

413
00:21:15.849 --> 00:21:19.170
you know, I don't want to ramble on there, but

414
00:21:19.230 --> 00:21:22.029
who better to explain that than yourself?

415
00:21:22.309 --> 00:21:26.559
Well, you did a good job. You missed some details.

416
00:21:26.579 --> 00:21:30.579
You know, four years ago, I started a grad collection

417
00:21:30.779 --> 00:21:33.640
with my wife just to really sell the inventory. But

418
00:21:34.089 --> 00:21:37.109
There's so much of it that's ongoing. And then in February,

419
00:21:37.230 --> 00:21:40.059
when part of ways with Beckett, which I helped found

420
00:21:40.099 --> 00:21:45.099
Beckett authentication 2016 with Brian Severo. And I kind of

421
00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:48.079
left that behind. I also stayed on board with Beckett

422
00:21:48.099 --> 00:21:51.569
in a different capacity to consult and train authenticators, which

423
00:21:51.640 --> 00:21:54.930
that is coming to an end soon too. So by

424
00:21:54.970 --> 00:21:57.990
the time this airs, that'll be over. So basically we said, well,

425
00:21:58.009 --> 00:21:59.630
we got to do some stuff here. It's not like

426
00:22:00.049 --> 00:22:04.109
I'm going to retire off of, you know, Paul Conergo autographs.

427
00:22:04.130 --> 00:22:06.319
It's not going to happen. So we have to be

428
00:22:06.390 --> 00:22:09.940
realistic about this. And we came up with a division

429
00:22:09.980 --> 00:22:12.240
of grad collection. We just called grad authentication. We'd like

430
00:22:12.259 --> 00:22:14.380
to keep the same branding and everything, but it's, if

431
00:22:14.400 --> 00:22:16.700
you go to grad collection.com, you could go to our

432
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:20.460
autograph review right on there. And we do a virtual letter.

433
00:22:20.759 --> 00:22:26.059
We do appraisals. We do grading. We do one-on-one sessions

434
00:22:26.099 --> 00:22:27.779
with me. If you want to buy that, if someone

435
00:22:27.819 --> 00:22:30.859
wants to go on to eBay with me for an hour,

436
00:22:31.410 --> 00:22:33.309
I could help them find real stuff or help them

437
00:22:33.329 --> 00:22:35.829
find the stuff they want, or I go through people's collections.

438
00:22:36.509 --> 00:22:40.640
The autograph review is great because, listen, you know this much,

439
00:22:40.920 --> 00:22:43.599
and you're very well-versed in this business. It's not like

440
00:22:43.740 --> 00:22:47.160
any company has good turnaround time. It's really bad. And

441
00:22:47.359 --> 00:22:49.069
we thought we'd jump into this and give people a

442
00:22:49.089 --> 00:22:52.690
different option of doing a digital letter. And for us,

443
00:22:52.750 --> 00:22:54.779
at least... you know, and me too, people say, how

444
00:22:54.799 --> 00:22:56.480
do you do that? Well, you know, I've been buying

445
00:22:56.519 --> 00:22:59.589
autographs forever online. We think of the early days, even,

446
00:22:59.609 --> 00:23:01.730
I mean, early days of eBay. If you remember, sometimes

447
00:23:01.750 --> 00:23:04.910
there was no photos back in like 98, 99 people.

448
00:23:04.970 --> 00:23:07.750
You didn't have to put a photo. I remember eBay

449
00:23:08.410 --> 00:23:10.309
before PayPal and, and.

450
00:23:10.789 --> 00:23:11.369
Oh yeah. Yeah.

451
00:23:11.589 --> 00:23:13.509
You used to have to mail a check or money.

452
00:23:13.710 --> 00:23:14.009
Yeah.

453
00:23:14.410 --> 00:23:17.009
If you mail the check, you'd have to wait till

454
00:23:17.049 --> 00:23:19.930
your check cleared before they ship. That's why you go

455
00:23:19.950 --> 00:23:21.730
to the bank and get a money order. If you

456
00:23:21.769 --> 00:23:24.109
wanted your stuff, faster right this.

457
00:23:24.029 --> 00:23:27.130
Is i remember those days yeah i mean i was

458
00:23:27.299 --> 00:23:29.700
i was on that platform selling so now you know

459
00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:32.220
people say well i can't get my stuff back fast

460
00:23:32.259 --> 00:23:34.299
enough um you know how do i send all this

461
00:23:34.380 --> 00:23:36.559
frame stuff how do i send these hockey sticks these

462
00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:39.500
baseball bats it so now we offer a service you

463
00:23:39.519 --> 00:23:41.460
know where i could um you know i'll view the

464
00:23:41.539 --> 00:23:44.549
items and we'll do a digital letter now some cases

465
00:23:44.960 --> 00:23:46.789
and it's happens it happens all the time with the

466
00:23:46.829 --> 00:23:50.109
autograph review is that the photo looks like a pre-print

467
00:23:50.130 --> 00:23:51.809
or something looks like a copy. And I just do

468
00:23:51.869 --> 00:23:54.150
unable to render opinion because I'm not going to put

469
00:23:54.190 --> 00:23:56.660
my leg, you know, so to speak and that type

470
00:23:56.680 --> 00:23:59.000
of water. So we just, I'm very careful about it.

471
00:23:59.980 --> 00:24:02.119
And people have always asked, they keep asking us, well,

472
00:24:02.160 --> 00:24:04.359
are you going to do little certs, you know, like stickers?

473
00:24:04.819 --> 00:24:07.220
And the answer to that is no, I'm not going

474
00:24:07.240 --> 00:24:09.900
to say no for certain. Okay. You know, I'm not

475
00:24:09.940 --> 00:24:11.900
pulling a Michael Jordan here, but at the same time,

476
00:24:11.940 --> 00:24:14.160
I'm saying it's just not in the cards because The

477
00:24:14.279 --> 00:24:17.420
one thing that requires is manpower and me being gone

478
00:24:17.460 --> 00:24:20.309
and traveling. And this time I'm deciding to do it.

479
00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:22.259
Like I want to do it with my wife where

480
00:24:22.279 --> 00:24:24.069
we want to spend our time, where we want to be.

481
00:24:24.460 --> 00:24:25.670
If we want to get in the RV and go

482
00:24:25.690 --> 00:24:27.410
up to Montana, we could do that. If we want

483
00:24:27.430 --> 00:24:29.230
to get on a plane and go to London, I

484
00:24:29.569 --> 00:24:31.789
could still do everything I do. I could do it

485
00:24:31.829 --> 00:24:34.789
right on computer or my phone and it's no problem.

486
00:24:34.849 --> 00:24:36.930
So for us, at least it made, it's going to

487
00:24:36.950 --> 00:24:40.160
make our lives easier and make it easier to do

488
00:24:40.220 --> 00:24:42.490
for me because I I have been doing the grind

489
00:24:42.549 --> 00:24:45.170
in this business forever and it's not great. You know,

490
00:24:45.190 --> 00:24:48.329
being on the road and planes and car rentals and hotels,

491
00:24:48.410 --> 00:24:50.069
and this is canceled and you got to go here

492
00:24:50.150 --> 00:24:53.450
and bad weather that's over. So, um, you know, it's

493
00:24:53.549 --> 00:24:56.309
just easy. If you visit us at grad collection.com, you

494
00:24:56.329 --> 00:24:58.250
could ask us questions there. We try to get back

495
00:24:58.269 --> 00:25:01.109
to everybody in 24 hours. The autograph review is as

496
00:25:01.150 --> 00:25:03.410
a 24 hour turnaround. In a lot of cases, it's

497
00:25:03.430 --> 00:25:05.549
a lot quicker. And we also have an upgrade if

498
00:25:05.569 --> 00:25:06.869
you want to do it in two hours or less,

499
00:25:06.930 --> 00:25:08.789
which listen, I do it most of the time, but

500
00:25:08.809 --> 00:25:10.289
if someone hits me up at three in the morning,

501
00:25:10.630 --> 00:25:12.980
It's not like I'm, you know, oh, here on my

502
00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:14.579
phone at three in the morning. I'm not doing that.

503
00:25:14.740 --> 00:25:17.200
So but, you know, we encourage people to do it

504
00:25:17.259 --> 00:25:20.400
that way. And I think it's it's just an alternative,

505
00:25:20.440 --> 00:25:23.619
especially for people in Europe, for people in Asia, for

506
00:25:23.640 --> 00:25:26.299
people in New Zealand who collect. By the way, there's

507
00:25:26.380 --> 00:25:28.920
huge markets out there. You know, I used to go

508
00:25:28.960 --> 00:25:32.519
do shows all the time in England. There's huge collectors

509
00:25:32.700 --> 00:25:35.880
in France and Germany. And I want them to know, like, listen,

510
00:25:35.900 --> 00:25:38.450
you have an alternative instead of. If you want to

511
00:25:38.470 --> 00:25:41.009
send in 10 photos to any of the big companies

512
00:25:41.069 --> 00:25:45.339
and you lived in Germany, between shipping, VAT, back and forth,

513
00:25:45.430 --> 00:25:50.359
by the way, declared values, turnaround times, you might wait

514
00:25:50.400 --> 00:25:52.619
a year to get your stuff back and pay an

515
00:25:52.700 --> 00:25:54.759
arm and a leg. So if you were paying $ 25

516
00:25:54.680 --> 00:25:57.529
just for COAs or stickers on your items and you're

517
00:25:57.569 --> 00:26:02.369
from Germany, you might actually have paying 40 double, 40 bucks,

518
00:26:02.369 --> 00:26:04.269
50 bucks a piece just to get those certified. Is

519
00:26:04.309 --> 00:26:06.740
that really worth it? we offer an alternative for people.

520
00:26:06.980 --> 00:26:10.099
It's worked very well so far today. You know, while

521
00:26:10.140 --> 00:26:12.339
this airs, I mean, by the time this airs, we'll, we'll,

522
00:26:12.460 --> 00:26:14.730
we'll have it out here for two months and we'll

523
00:26:14.750 --> 00:26:17.170
keep chugging along. So it's, it's really cool to do it.

524
00:26:17.390 --> 00:26:20.589
And obviously the education stuff on YouTube, which I'm going

525
00:26:20.609 --> 00:26:23.410
to continue doing that as long as I can and

526
00:26:23.470 --> 00:26:25.769
doing this, you know, and I know sometimes I look

527
00:26:25.789 --> 00:26:27.500
at my views on them. I'm like, well, that's not great,

528
00:26:27.579 --> 00:26:30.460
but you know, we do the evolution series where I

529
00:26:30.500 --> 00:26:32.319
do it once a month or twice a month. I

530
00:26:32.359 --> 00:26:35.799
come out with, two signers a month and you know,

531
00:26:35.819 --> 00:26:38.619
Babe Ruth, whether it's Babe Ruth or any player or

532
00:26:38.720 --> 00:26:41.799
any celebrity, I try to just figure out someone. And

533
00:26:41.839 --> 00:26:44.759
I enjoy doing that because I break down like Babe Ruth,

534
00:26:44.779 --> 00:26:47.599
I can go from 1915 up until a week before

535
00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:51.299
he died in 1948. So I could run the gamut

536
00:26:51.359 --> 00:26:52.579
and I could do it with Luke Gehrig and I

537
00:26:52.599 --> 00:26:54.299
could do it with, and I'm going to do Gehrig,

538
00:26:54.319 --> 00:26:57.160
you know, Clemente, there's a great Clemente one out there too.

539
00:26:57.200 --> 00:26:59.220
And I explained what to look for in his autograph.

540
00:27:00.160 --> 00:27:01.980
He has got to tell every time he signs his name.

541
00:27:02.650 --> 00:27:05.490
And also what to look for with the clubhouse and

542
00:27:05.529 --> 00:27:08.880
secretarial signatures. And then the forgeries, which are prevalent, as

543
00:27:08.910 --> 00:27:10.019
you know. I don't have to tell you.

544
00:27:10.319 --> 00:27:13.099
Yeah, and that's great that you offer that. And no

545
00:27:13.140 --> 00:27:16.140
matter what continent you're on, right, you can take advantage.

546
00:27:16.500 --> 00:27:20.119
Every year we read, right, the rates are going up,

547
00:27:20.160 --> 00:27:24.190
whether it be the United States Postal Service or UPS. Like,

548
00:27:24.230 --> 00:27:28.230
it's not going down. No, it's not. Heck, a stamp now.

549
00:27:28.269 --> 00:27:30.890
I remember when stamps used to be like a quarter stamp.

550
00:27:31.309 --> 00:27:34.670
And now they're like, you know, they're approaching, what, 70.

551
00:27:34.670 --> 00:27:35.630
Times are changing.

552
00:27:35.650 --> 00:27:35.759
Yeah.

553
00:27:36.599 --> 00:27:40.200
Yeah. So it's nice that that, you know, and they're

554
00:27:40.220 --> 00:27:43.039
getting probably arguably the best person in the biz.

555
00:27:43.339 --> 00:27:44.299
I appreciate that.

556
00:27:44.319 --> 00:27:47.980
Thank you. Expert opinion on top of that. Right. Anyone

557
00:27:48.009 --> 00:27:51.789
can say they're this or that or we provide this. Right.

558
00:27:51.829 --> 00:27:54.829
But you sort of have that pedigree as far as

559
00:27:54.849 --> 00:27:59.019
like enjoying time with family. Right. You paid your dues, Steve, right?

560
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:01.700
You've done this a long time. Like you said, it

561
00:28:01.720 --> 00:28:04.420
is a grind, and you've done it for a while.

562
00:28:04.440 --> 00:28:08.109
And listen, it's all right to enjoy life and travel.

563
00:28:08.630 --> 00:28:11.150
It is. You put in the work, right? It's not

564
00:28:11.190 --> 00:28:14.410
like you were lazy.

565
00:28:13.390 --> 00:28:13.970
For 30, 40 years.

566
00:28:14.549 --> 00:28:17.710
You worked, and now it's time for– and you're still

567
00:28:17.779 --> 00:28:20.619
doing it. It's not like you're riding off in the sunset. No.

568
00:28:20.660 --> 00:28:24.539
But you also spend a little time. on yourself and

569
00:28:24.579 --> 00:28:26.779
with family. And that's always important.

570
00:28:26.980 --> 00:28:29.140
That's a good thing, right? That's important because it keeps

571
00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:31.690
you going and you can't, you know, you can't do

572
00:28:31.730 --> 00:28:34.250
the grind all the time. I mean, Jim Spence is

573
00:28:34.410 --> 00:28:38.589
basically retired. He still is an authenticator. And I talked

574
00:28:38.630 --> 00:28:41.289
to Jim just recently and we just caught up and,

575
00:28:41.369 --> 00:28:43.119
you know, cause I came up through this with Jim

576
00:28:43.819 --> 00:28:46.079
and you know, he's enjoying his life a lot more.

577
00:28:46.160 --> 00:28:48.900
He doesn't travel and he does stuff at the office

578
00:28:49.019 --> 00:28:51.180
and he's still very active in the autograph stuff and

579
00:28:51.200 --> 00:28:54.059
looking at stuff and being part of it. And, I'm

580
00:28:54.140 --> 00:28:56.180
active in it too, but at the same time, I'm

581
00:28:56.200 --> 00:28:58.079
choosing how to do it. And I don't, you know,

582
00:28:58.200 --> 00:29:00.569
I've enjoyed working for these companies. I worked for Collectors

583
00:29:00.609 --> 00:29:04.150
Universe for almost 15 years. I worked for Beckett for

584
00:29:04.170 --> 00:29:07.190
almost 10 years. I had some really good relationships and friends.

585
00:29:07.210 --> 00:29:09.609
There were some good times and bad times, but at

586
00:29:09.650 --> 00:29:11.269
the end of the day, I don't have to do

587
00:29:11.289 --> 00:29:14.019
that anymore. I could work for myself and kind of

588
00:29:14.079 --> 00:29:16.660
navigate those waters. And, you know, my wife and I

589
00:29:16.819 --> 00:29:18.839
have it, you know, kind of figured out how we

590
00:29:18.859 --> 00:29:20.839
want to do it. We don't have to let someone

591
00:29:20.880 --> 00:29:23.009
else decide for us. You know, you're, You know, I

592
00:29:23.029 --> 00:29:24.549
don't have to go to Dallas anymore and I don't

593
00:29:24.569 --> 00:29:26.349
have to go to this show and I don't have

594
00:29:26.369 --> 00:29:27.930
to sit in a warehouse till three in the morning

595
00:29:27.970 --> 00:29:30.779
because I don't have to. And it's it's my decision.

596
00:29:30.819 --> 00:29:31.609
So I'm good with it.

597
00:29:31.720 --> 00:29:34.859
You're your CEO and you're the boss. You set the schedule.

598
00:29:35.079 --> 00:29:35.579
Yes, sir.

599
00:29:35.619 --> 00:29:38.839
That's a that's a good thing. Well, I know you're busy.

600
00:29:38.900 --> 00:29:39.819
That goes without saying.

601
00:29:40.140 --> 00:29:43.980
We, we, we appreciate you making some time. Pleasure. We're

602
00:29:44.039 --> 00:29:47.960
recording this before the national full disclosure. So I hope

603
00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:50.769
to see you here in a, in a week or two.

604
00:29:50.789 --> 00:29:51.009
Oh yeah.

605
00:29:51.029 --> 00:29:51.589
I want to make sure.

606
00:29:51.609 --> 00:29:52.250
Yeah, we will.

607
00:29:52.329 --> 00:29:55.289
So that is full disclosure, but yeah, you come by

608
00:29:55.309 --> 00:29:58.759
and see me and please main, main show floor. You know,

609
00:29:59.180 --> 00:30:02.799
probably same booth next year, but 509-511. And please come

610
00:30:02.819 --> 00:30:04.000
by and say hi to my wife and I. We'd

611
00:30:04.019 --> 00:30:04.480
love to see you.

612
00:30:04.759 --> 00:30:06.660
Yeah, I appreciate it. Thanks, Steve.

613
00:30:07.079 --> 00:30:09.140
Pleasure. Talk to you soon, man.

614
00:30:09.220 --> 00:30:13.119
Time for our Hobby is the People, announcer of the week.

615
00:30:16.319 --> 00:30:18.480
This is Mike Summer from the Wax Pack Hero Sports

616
00:30:18.529 --> 00:30:22.690
Card Minute. Don't forget, the hobby is the people. If

617
00:30:22.769 --> 00:30:25.309
you'd like to be the Hobby is the People announcer

618
00:30:25.349 --> 00:30:28.690
of the week, do a WAV or MP3 file and

619
00:30:28.769 --> 00:30:32.950
send it to sportscardnationpc at gmail.com.
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